Another CPAP Cleaner Hits the Market

[SarcasticDave94]

Is this it?  

Sam's club has this in 24 gallons. OK I'm kidding, but if it existed, it'll last a Papper for a few years.

[sleepyzzz]

have you tried it yet ?

[WannabeRestwright]

Your question is certainly a fair one, and I appreciate your precision.  That is to be admired!  No, I did not perform any clinical tests of its sterilization effect.  So I am embarassed to say perhaps I am too gullible in over-trusting the claims of the manufacturer on this. That said, however, I must report that consistently ALL items I have treated with the Lumin which would normally carry some sort of dingy cast seem to me quite freshened when coming out of the Lumin drawer.  And, wonderfully, they seem to ***maintain this same freshness for a very good long period after a Lumin cleaning event. *** For example, brushes of various different types do not revert to their bascially unappealling grimy-ness anywhere near as soon as they "normally" do if just washed with soap and water, or even soaked for a while with a bleach-based solution.  And I honestly have a lot of experience using bleaches for their disinfection effects -- since my life has included both 10+ years running a very healthy working dairy as well as 20+ years in water quality mgmt for residential swimming pools, both indoors and out.  I have to conclude that the promised disinfection effect of the Lumin IS occurring with my unit in a manner that is definitely more complete than my otherwise manual methods of handwashing these items (including, of course, my sleep apnea equiipment -- which I pretty much hover over and prize!)  In sum, the Lumin seems to more fully knock out the collection of odor- and grime-causing living organisms that would otherwise re-grow and re-populate personal care items in fairly short order.   Hope this helps.  And again, I appreciate your precision on this matter.

[zzz1]

All I use is 3.4% hydrogen peroxide from Walmart.  I add about 1/2 cup to a humidifier chamber and slosh it around.  I use a Q-tip to physically clean out any corners and crevices.  If there is any biofilm, it float out and makes the peroxide cloudy.  Works extremely well.  Rinse to finish.  The same thing can be done with a CPAP tube.  Pour enough in to make a pool, then alternately lift each end.  The foaming action of peroxide on any organic matter lifts it off the surface and disinfects.  This is not a system, it is just a well-know way to disinfect without odor or residues.

I have a summer cottage with well water that sometimes develops a sulfurous smell.  Peroxide is often used in hot water tanks and water systems. Peroxide disinfects, and the byproduct is oxygen.  I dump a quart of peroxide into the water heater and it kills the sulfur bacteria and leaves the water odor free. Pretty cool, huh?

I'm interested in the essential oils that you use  - I didn't know you could do that.  Allergies are going to be a huge problem for me when I start cutting the grass again.  They are a big enough problem now along with dry, winter air.  What kind of oils and how much do you use?  Do you have any concerns with breathing the oil molecules through the humidifier all night?

[vroomvroom]

All I use is 3.4% hydrogen peroxide from Walmart.  I add about 1/2 cup to a humidifier chamber and slosh it around.  I use a Q-tip to physically clean out any corners and crevices.  If there is any biofilm, it float out and makes the peroxide cloudy.  Works extremely well.  Rinse to finish.  The same thing can be done with a CPAP tube.  Pour enough in to make a pool, then alternately lift each end.  The foaming action of peroxide on any organic matter lifts it off the surface and disinfects.  This is not a system, it is just a well-know way to disinfect without odor or residues.

I have a summer cottage with well water that sometimes develops a sulfurous smell.  Peroxide is often used in hot water tanks and water systems. Peroxide disinfects, and the byproduct is oxygen.  I dump a quart of peroxide into the water heater and it kills the sulfur bacteria and leaves the water odor free. Pretty cool, huh?

I'm interested in the essential oils that you use  - I didn't know you could do that.  Allergies are going to be a huge problem for me when I start cutting the grass again.  They are a big enough problem now along with dry, winter air.  What kind of oils and how much do you use?  Do you have any concerns with breathing the oil molecules through the humidifier all night?

Agreed on the questions!

[Marillion]

I read the scientific studies at the 3B website. This product appears to be more effective than SoClean. The lab data are certainly more convincing. They demonstrated a 5 log reduction of resistant bacterial spores in well controlled studies. That is more overkill than would be required to sanitize CPAP equipment. To minimize the shadowing issue the interior of the chamber is highly polished aluminum which reflects UV light.  The machine is designed to accommodate a single mask or water chamber. It does not appear suitable for hoses. There are, however, some caveats.

In spite of the polished aluminum chamber I still see a problem with shadowing. The mask with headgear attached, for example, is placed in the chamber face up and rests on the bottom of the chamber. The UV light is at the top of the chamber and shines down. It seems the portions of the mask setting on the bottom of the chamber would block UV light and prevent it from being reflected back up against those surfaces. Also, they show the mask placed in the chamber with the headgear attached. It seems unlikely that the headgear would not result in some shadowing. Additionally, the interior of opaque tubular components such as hose connectors would probably not be fully exposed to the UV light.   Parts of the frames of some masks such as the AmaraView are not clear plastic and would also probably interfere with light transmission.

Santization of the water chamber is probably more effective as long as the opaque metal bottom is not placed against the aluminum interior of the chamber.

Although a 5 log kill of resistant spores was demonstrated the study report does not indicate that any worst case conditions were employed, which is generally a requirement for validation of sterilization and sanitization. The challenge spores were on stainless steel strips placed in the chamber with the masks and water chambers. The report does not say where they were placed. Placement on top of the items directly under the UV light would be much less of a challenge than under the mask or inside of the opaque hose connector, which would be worst case. Failure to place the challenge spores at worst case locations constitutes a serious flaw to the study. (If worst case site were used, I suspect it would have been mentioned in the report.)

Effectiveness of the system depends on the mirror finish of the aluminum chamber which they concede is easily scratched and requires special care. I would have concerns with how well it will hold up to routine use.

As with SoCean, the items to be sanitized must be cleaned before sanitization. I do credit 3B medical for being up front about this in their instructions and not implying their system cleans.

The bottom line is, for those that feel the need for a high level of sanitization, the 3B system appears to be more effective and safer than SoClean but may not sanitize some mask surfaces. It does not appear suitable for hoses which will require an additional method for sanitization. The cost of the machine is similar, about $300 but is probably less expensive to use since no disposables are required.

In my opinion as a microbiologist and CPAP user, this is another solution for which there is no need. Regular cleaning with mild detergent supplemented occasionally with a mild and inexpensive sanitizing agent is adequate to keep our equipment free of significant numbers of microorganisms. I clean my equipment less frequently then most on the forum and see no indication of significant microbial colonization.

Since no one else has said so, I will.  This is the best and most complete answer in this thread, though Sleeprider summed it up very well also.  You simply cannot get a better answer than this.  I for one will be using Dawn and Hydrogen Peroxide (HP if needed, which I have not had to in the past 2 years of use.)  Other than allaying unfounded fears I simply cannot see the need for products such as this and Soclean which are designed to part some from their hard earned dollars.  Caveat Emptor!

[japers]

I find myself in fundamental agreement with those who find the UV and Ozone sanitizing systems to be solutions in search of a problem, but I'd like to point out that not all people have the same needs. I appreciate the fact that we have some folks with real world expertise weighing in on the matter.

Do we have an epidemiologist on board? The reason I ask is that I have been fighting a dual-pronged attack from my immune system for almost forty years -- Granulomatosis with Polyangiitis (formerly known as Weggener's Granulomatosis) and Systemic Sarcoidosis with lung, heart, liver, and aortic involvement. I have been treated with Cyclophosphamide, Methotrexate, Azathioprine, and Rituximab for years along with shorter courses of a number of immune system modifiers and chemotherapy agents -- in addition to a LOT of prednisone / prednisalone.

As anyone schooled in these matters may know, my immune system has taken a beating so that it couldn't beat me! The problem is that, for the past twenty or so years, I have been an easy target for every respiratory bug  that has come within shooting distance. I have had to have pulses of prednisone combined with 3-4 weeks of heavy Amoxicillin / Clavulinic Acid antibacterial treatment every 2-3 months for years. I spent hours every day on nebulizers.

I finally had to stop leaving my condominium for any occasions other than medical appointments. When leaving the condo I wear a special respirator, and I clean my hands like an OCD nut. I'm sure strangers (and some not-so-strangers) think I'm a lunatic or a Monk sequel. But the URIs have stopped hitting me for the past five years without a single recurrence, and I think this is probably due to these precautions recommended by my immunologists. Hence, no more prednisone pulses with a possibility of being free of them in a few more months, and no more massive antiobiotic insults on my system.

A year ago I was put on APAP. Despite using stringent cleaning procedures for the equipment and its environment I wound up with a severe acute bronchitis which evolved into pneumonia. I was hospitalized and treated with IV antibiotics before I could recover.

I started APAP again in December of 2018. I've been using a SoClean 2 in addition to the previous cleaning protocols. I chose it because it treats the entire circuit. Ten weeks in, no problems with upper respiratory infections.

My story is only anecdotal evidence, but I have to take the situation seriously. I doubt that anyone using UV or Ozone is likely to suffer anything other than a thinner wallet, and some people may benefit.

Obviously, they won't be likely to benefit if they fail to clean the equipment before subjecting it to the sterilization process.

Just a YMMV sort of yarn.

 

Too bad there isn't a lawn chair smiley!

Sleep well!