Mouth Breathing

[mcsheltie]

Chin straps mostly just remind you to keep your mouth closed, since most stretch, and your jaw is strong, and even if they hold your jaw closed, you can still breath through your lips. I now, been there and tried everything - including gluing and taping my mouth shut... I ended up having to go with a FFM.

Good luck!

Well that bites! Guess I won't try the super glue after all.

[FrankNichols]

Super flue might actually work, but be sure to put a straw in to eat through first

I used Denture Adhesive on the lips for gluing them shut. It works mostly, but was a PIA to put on right and get off in the morning. Not worth the effort.

Frank

[mcsheltie]

So I tried the TAP PAP for the first time last night. I've been fighting (literally) the DreamWear for the past two weeks. I love it! I didn't have a leak all night. With the DreamWear every time I would change position I had to wake completely up and readjust the mask. It would shoot me in the eye, side of the face... somewhere, every time.

When I checked my data this morning I was surprised to see the leak rate was wayyyyy up. I assume mouth breathing adds to the leak rate... right? Probably the mouth piece encourages mouth breathing. There weren't any leaks around the nasal pillows.

[mcsheltie]

Second night with the TAP PAP. It didn't wake me once with a leak. I can sleep on my side and on my stomach. I used barb wire and super glue to keep my mouth shut. SleepyHead says the leak rate is high. AHI still below 2.

With the leaking, annoying DreamWear my AHI was 0.7 and the leak rate was lower. I don't get it...LOL

I'm off to the DME to see what trouble I can get into!

[mcsheltie]

Back from the DME. I came home with the Wisp. Tried the P10. I REALLY wanted to like it. But the headgear is so flimsy and every time I moved my head around the seal would break. Same issues as I am having with the DreamWear. Tried the Nuance. The headgear is much better, but same issues with the pillows.

After using pillows I felt like I wasn't getting the same amount of air with the Wisp. I had my machine, so that wasn't the case. I tried another over the nose style and it felt the same. So I think I will get used to it.

Since I am having problems mouth breathing I also tried the F10 and one other FFM (can't remember which) When I closed my eyes and breathed through my mouth, my ears would pop and it really messed up the pressure. Plus my lower lip could easily end up below the mask. One more thing to wake me up during the night ....so the Wisp won!

[Galactus]

P10, all the way. The "flimsy headgear" and the "breaking seal" all go away after two nights as the pillows seat in the nostrils. Once that happens the seal will take over, the flimsy headgear will be awesome and the seal will stay. While breaking in the pillows use some lanolin on them to assist the seal first few nights. After that loose is good, it doesn't need to be tight or heavy to seal well.

As to mouth breathing, some training could help you. Sit in a chair, don the mask, use it for 30 minutes training your tongue to stay in the right place. Do it for a week, and see if it doesn't help your body get it right when you're asleep. It helped me.

The P10 is like fairy dust and magic, lol.

[mcsheltie]

P10, all the way. The "flimsy headgear" and the "breaking seal" all go away after two nights as the pillows seat in the nostrils. Once that happens the seal will take over, the flimsy headgear will be awesome and the seal will stay.

Really? Thanks for that! I laid down and every time I moved the seal would break. The rep had no idea of that. She didn't think it would work for me either.

As to mouth breathing, some training could help you. Sit in a chair, don the mask, use it for 30 minutes training your tongue to stay in the right place. Do it for a week, and see if it doesn't help your body get it right when you're asleep. It helped me.

Thx again I'll do it!!!

The P10 is like fairy dust and magic, lol.

Hmmm... I have to say I am skeptical... but I'll give it a shot!

[Galactus]

P10, all the way. The "flimsy headgear" and the "breaking seal" all go away after two nights as the pillows seat in the nostrils. Once that happens the seal will take over, the flimsy headgear will be awesome and the seal will stay.

Really? Thanks for that! I laid down and every time I moved the seal would break. The rep had no idea of that. She didn't think it would work for me either.

For me personally I think it's like a new pair of pants, or a baseball glove, it takes a bit of break in time. Your body isn't really used to this "new thing" so there's a bit of your nostrils conforming, your mind adapting, and it takes a little time for everything to get working on the same page. That's how it is for me anyway. When the seal starting working good my nose would get sore. It took some time to develop the right fit, I don't want to say callouses because that's not right, but the skin and the nostrils, it did take some getting used to. I also find currently every time I switch to a new nasal pillow and it's all new and tough it still takes a day or two before it sort of breaks in and seals good. The first 2-3 nights of a new pillow just annoy the heck out of me for this reason. I touch a tiny bit of lanolin to it to help make the seal but still those two nights are never good. Then viola, back to normal and all is good in the world. This is just my experience and I'm sharing in the hopes it helps you.

As to mouth breathing, some training could help you. Sit in a chair, don the mask, use it for 30 minutes training your tongue to stay in the right place. Do it for a week, and see if it doesn't help your body get it right when you're asleep. It helped me.

Thx again I'll do it!!!

This step really helped me get used to the feeling of wearing it as when I would wake up initially during my therapy it was a little disconcerting, and so while awake I guess my mind wrapped around using the mask, and when it woke me at night at the beginning it got easier to just roll back over and fall asleep again. It also gave me an idea of how the mask really needed to sit on my face to seal properly, and how tight it really needed to be as during my fitting they tightened it way more than it needed to be. You would think that would help with the seal, but it doesn't, especially not for me. My pressure was higher initially and so as it was tight then the air came in and it was fighting to push out, after loosening the pillows filled with air and sealed much better. It didn't seem logical when I thought about it and when it was suggested, but it did work. And being awake in a chair rather than trying to get to sleep made it easier to see what would and wouldn't work.

The P10 is like fairy dust and magic, lol.

Hmmm... I have to say I am skeptical... but I'll give it a shot!

Ok, so I exaggerate a little, lol. But for me it really made the whole therapy process so much better. Had I been forced to use the first mask they forced on me I might never have been able to do this.

All the best!

[mcsheltie]

The P10 is like fairy dust and magic, lol.

Hmmm... I have to say I am skeptical... but I'll give it a shot!

Ok, so I exaggerate a little, lol. But for me it really made the whole therapy process so much better. Had I been forced to use the first mask they forced on me I might never have been able to do this.

All the best!


How much do you move around at night? I toss and turn all night. Having to adjust a mask each time has made sleeping almost impossible. I still can't believe that nasal pillows with no support will stay put as I toss and turn.

[robysue]

How much do you move around at night? I toss and turn all night. Having to adjust a mask each time has made sleeping almost impossible. I still can't believe that nasal pillows with no support will stay put as I toss and turn.

I'm a pretty active sleeper---in that I move around enough to tear the covers up on a regular basis.

I've used both the Swift FX nasal pillows mask and the P10 nasal pillows mask and I don't have much trouble with either of them moving around during the night. There are a quite a few of things that can affect the stability of the pillows:

1) With the FX it's important to have both straps adjusted so the mask straps are quite loose. I can easily get several fingers between the top strap and the top of my head and one or two fingers will easily slip under the back strap when my FX is positioned correctly.

2) The P10's straps are not really adjustable and I personally find that they are much too tight. I have to use the "regular" P10 headgear since the "for her" headgear is tight enough to cause headaches for me. I also find that I have to spread the straps as far apart as possible to keep it from pulling the pillows too tight against my nostrils.

3) Both masks use a double-cone air cushion seal. If the pillows are too tight against the nostrils, the air cushion between the two cones does not inflate properly, and then the mask is prone to leaks AND moving around too much.

4) If the nasal pillows are too small, they poke too far into your nostrils. This is uncomfortable AND it prevent the air cushion from fully inflating. So you get more leaks and more mask movement during the night.

5) Using pillows that are slightly too large is less problematic than using pillows that are too small.

6) The angle between the pillows and the bottom of the nose is critically important. Be sure to read the instructions carefully--there are pictures indicating both correct and incorrect angles. If the angle is correct, the air cushion fully inflates and the mask is quite stable. If the angle is incorrect, any one of several things can go wrong: It might pinch the nostrils in a painful way; or it might cause too much of the pillow tip to go into the nostril; or it may prevent the mask from sealing properly.

7) As long as you have the mask close to the correct angle, reseating the FX and P10 pillows in the middle of the night is really easy and I can now do it in my sleep: All you have to do is pull the pillows very slightly away from the nostrils and then let go---the mask will settle back down on the nostrils at the right angle with a high quality seal.

8) If the inner cone becomes inverted, the mask simply won't seal. You have to take it off and re-invert the inner cone by pressing on it. If this happens frequently, that's usually a sign that the pillows are worn out and need to be replaced.

8) Hose placement is critical for the FX, but it's a bit less critical for the P10. The FX has a very heavy short hose and it can pull the pillows away from the nostrils. The P10's hose is much lighter and hence much less likely to pull the pillows off the nostrils.

With both masks, I personally run the hose under the covers and next to my body. I usually fall asleep holding onto the hose with both hands---hugging it so to speak. One hand is usually near the mask end on the small hose, the other is farther down on the main hose. When I turn over, the hands just guide the hose to where I'm going and that prevents the heavy hose from pulling the nasal pillows off my face.

Others find that hanging the hose with just the right amount of slack allows them to freely turn over however they wish without the hose pulling the mask on their face.


In helping people troubleshoot FX/P10 problems that do not involve mouth breathing, it seems to me that the things that cause the most trouble are (1) over tightening the FX headgear or leaving the straps of the P10 too close to each other and (2) using pillows that are too small for their nostrils.