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+--- Thread: [News] RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS (/Thread-News-RECALL-THREAD-IMPORTANT-PHILIPS-DREAMSTATION-SYSTEM-ONE-USERS)
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RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - RayBee - 06-17-2021
I find it interesting that many people speculate (I'm not picking on anybody here folks) on what Philips did, is doing (or not), should have done, knew, should have known, and the list goes on and on. I understand how people feel about the whole situation. My dear friend has had numerous, severe and crippling health issues that we now know are all due to her Dreamstation's internal foam parts reacting to regular usage of her SoClean.
Yes, I understand how people entrust their health to Philips and feel betrayed when something like this comes about. I get it. But let me play devil's advocate for a minute. Not that I am in camp Philips, because I am not, nor do I defend them. But there is an irony here that I see.
According to the CDC 480,000 deaths each year in the US alone are attributed to cigarette smoking. People seem to be happy campers slowly killing themselves by sucking on these cancer sticks, putting known carcinogens into their lungs, every day. And are willingly doing so until the day they prematurely die a miserable, preventable and senseless death. And now we're P*ssed at Philips.
On one hand, I get it. On the other hand, I don't get it. I'm not a smoker, new was, never will be.
I guess we, the end user, can't really do much other than jump onto a class action lawsuit or wait until Philips puts into motion some plan-of-action to resolve the situation. I was able to get an older model PR REMstar CPAP for my friend that is not on the recall list. I hope it helps to resolve her Dreamstation/SoClean health related problems, and take care of her OSA.
RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - WakeUpTime - 06-17-2021
(06-17-2021, 11:19 PM)RayBee Wrote: My dear friend has had numerous, severe and crippling health issues that we now know are all due to her Dreamstation's internal foam parts reacting to regular usage of her SoClean.
...
I was able to get an older model PR REMstar CPAP for my friend that is not on the recall list.
Good work on finding a quick solution for your friend. You're a good friend, indeed.
If Philips solely and privately performs the refurbishment of the devices on the recall list, we may never truly understand the degree of health risk brought on by the cancer-causing chemicals contained within the deteriorating foam inside the Philips machines.
It would be preferable for a government agency, state health authority, consumer reports, or any other third party, to have access to these recalled devices before they have been refurbished and fully cleaned, in order to analyze them for their current state of off-gassing, material breakdown, contamination, deterioration, etc.
Users should be made aware of the degree of health risk that they have undertaken - as a result of the years of design-flawed machine use - categorized by machine type, machine age, and ozone cleaning use. Philips will also have a substantial database of detailed recall user and machine details that collectively can be highly informative, and individually can be used for any potential lawsuit in the years to come.
RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - racprops - 06-18-2021
Well people I have done all I can.
At this point you have all the facts I have been able to find and figure out.
I have shared what I did to save myself from sleepless nights. I removed the foam.
I have shown you the foam in both Phillips and ResMed’s machines.
I have explained that any changes you make on your own can and most likely will void any and all warranties. Including Phillips offer to repair/replace their systems.
This can even effect what your health insurance might be willing to do.
I have explained where I stand on all of these issues, and that in my case I have had to go it alone when it has come down to the treatment, service of my machines, and the buying of them as my Medicare and Access will not treat my need for good sleep cycles with a ASV machine as my first sleep test showed I needed.
I have advised you about these risks.
I have said what you do about this mess is up to you and that anything you do or not do is at your own risk.
I have advised you that I cannot suggest you do what I have done.
I have shown you what and how I did what I did.
I can do no more.
Good luck with whatever you do in the future.
Rich
RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - btreger - 06-18-2021
As the owner of a DreamStation Go CPAP machine, I would like to share some information and ask a question:
1. Health info:
Symptoms of exposure to particles from the degraded foam include headache, irritation, inflammation, respiratory issues, and possible toxic and cancer-causing effects, the company said.
I have no intention of risking my health with a Philips retrofit upgrade. This is not a bad airbag regulator, this a life, and death situation.
2. Travel CPAP recommendations:
My home machine is a ResMed AirSense 10 AutoSet. I would like to get a new travel machine to replace the Philips unit. I have no intention of using a Philips product, but would greatly appreciate any recommendations.
RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - RayBee - 06-18-2021
(06-18-2021, 08:56 AM)btreger Wrote: ...
2. Travel CPAP recommendations:
My home machine is a ResMed AirSense 10 AutoSet. I would like to get a new travel machine to replace the Philips unit. I have no intention of using a Philips product, but would greatly appreciate any recommendations.
Kind of straying off topic. Perhaps you could start a new thread and give some detailed specifics of you traveling machine's needs.
RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - JaneAM - 06-18-2021
Hi btregger - I agree with you - I've been using the Philips DreamStation at home and the DreamStation Go model when I travel - no intention to use either one of them ever again after finding about the recall problems. This is particularly true since I was diagnosed with cancer last December - about 4 and 1/2 years after faithfully using the Philips CPAPs. Who knows if it was related, but not interested in any more Philips products. Anyway - my research led me to the ResMed AirMini Travel CPAP - just ordered it today. Good luck to you!
RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - racprops - 06-18-2021
"I have no intention of using a Philips product, but would greatly appreciate any recommendations."
I felt VERY much as you do: BUT the only equal to Phillips is RESMED as I need a ASV machine and ONLY Phillips and ResMed make them, and they also have some kind of foam in their machines and it seems to be EVEN MORE in the air flow and used as air filter.
So at this time ResMed are not doing a recall.
Is it that their units are truly safe?? OR is it because they are not based within the US they are not subject to our product safety laws.
Or SO far no one has complained or enough people have complained to cause a concern??
As I understand it: "And as far as substantiation for this recall if there wasn’t enough of it they would not have done a full recall. People have been complaining for over three years about this to get to this point."
So for me it came down to: Spend $1300.00 for a USED REFURBISHED ResMed Air Curve 10 ASV that I now know comes with some kind of foam in it and that I cannot remove it because if I do I void all warranty.
OR Fix my Phillips machine myself. my machines are totally out of warranty so no harm there.
The Good news is I never used a cleaning machine and there is NO evidence of any foam dust or any smell. I seem to have gotten to it in time, other than any small amounts of out gassing I have lived with over the 5 or so years of using a Dreamstation.
Also as I do my own treatment and have gotten my avg. AHIs to under 2.0 normally and as I now seem to fully understand my Dreamstation ASV machine I also worried if I would be able to do as well on the ResMed machine.
And the 3 to 5 years of using the older System Ones ASV Machines, which I believe are not part of this recall. Their foam seems to be only as support of the motor housing and does not seem to have any way into the air flow.
Of course your needs may be different.
My 2 cents worth.
Rich
RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - PUNJABI408 - 06-18-2021
I think all people should submit their own machine info to Respironics. Do not wait for your DME to do it. DME have so many patients that they have to put in, so yours might not be entered for a while. I talked to my DME and Philips is telling them to compile a list of patient names, number and address so that the third party that is dealing with repairs/exchanges can contact the patients. Also, the DME did say that Resmed machines have a foam (like others have posted) in them and that they have tried calling/email about it and have not got any reply back about what material the foam is. I have a S9 at home and a Dreamstation for camping/traveling. I Personally do not like the Resmed S10, but do have an S9 and they are built way better than the S10.
I would not use the machine, but i know for ASV/ST there are no options right now. If you do decide to keep using your machine or have an ASV/ST, there are filters (Bacterial and Viral Filter for CPAP) that can be installed to make sure no particles can pass through and I would also use the heated humidifier that way some particles if any will fall into the water chamber. This will only work for particles and not against any vapors.
RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - WakeUpTime - 06-18-2021
(06-18-2021, 06:09 AM)racprops Wrote: ...
I have shared what I did to save myself from sleepless nights. I removed the foam. I have shown you the foam in both Phillips and ResMed’s machines.
...
You've made an outstanding contribution that we all appreciate! It's valuable information to either modify or provide insight to many.
In an earlier post (I can't remember where I saw it) someone mentioned that they noticed a different level of airflow AFTER they removed the phone in their machine, so they adjusted their settings accordingly. Did you find that? If that's true, there are several implications:
(1) people will need to update their airflow settings afterwards
(2) the recall process will also have to include an update to individual user settings - presumably done by each DME - which will extend both the time and the cost of the "repair" -- even if Philips instead ships a separate replacement machine, they'll want a DME to do a setup
On another note, will the Philips Recall Process be something like...
(1) wait for Philips to be ready for the recall logistics to be setup
(2) wait for our turn to return our Philips machine
(3) wait for our specific machine to arrive at the processing center (one week)
(4) repair the machine (could take days/weeks with a backlog)
(5) return-ship to a DME (one week)
(6) have a meeting date setup (1-2 week backlog?)
RE: RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS - btreger - 06-18-2021
Much thanks to all of you who responded to my post. I think JaneAM has the right answer for me and is what I will also do.
There has been a lot of discussions on this board and in the news and from Philips of the numerous medical effects that are possible when using their various CPAP products. I have not read anything linking these effects and having lasting complications from COVID or any of the vaccines that we all hopefully have taken. Just saying.
One thing you all may want to start doing and keep doing every night before you put your mask on is to turn on the "Run Mask Fit". Let it run for 15 or 20 seconds. This will force air through all your hoses, and hopefully, remove any build-up of any particles.
Burt