+- Apnea Board Forum - CPAP | Sleep Apnea (https://www.apneaboard.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Public Area (https://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Forum-Public-Area)
+--- Forum: Main Apnea Board Forum (https://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Forum-Main-Apnea-Board-Forum)
+--- Thread: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap (/Thread-Oxygen-levels-below-90-for-7-of-night-and-below-94-for-34-inspite-of-Bipap)
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - TechieHippie - 03-02-2024
Croc - Dipping to 70 is likely harmful and dangerous to your health. You probably need to be on supplemental oxygen while you are figuring this out. I wouldn't delay in talking to your doctor about this. It's easy to feed oxygen into the BiPAP at night.
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - bhavintu79 - 03-03-2024
Hi everyone
This is an amazing set of suggestions from all of you and I have some updates for everyone
Latest updates
- As of last night, I switched to the AirCurve 10 CS PaceWave adaptive servo-ventilator version. The resulting Oscar graphs show that AHI events have gone down substantially. My oxygen drops reduced to 58 from 100. However I was still below 90% for 4% of the night. This is just one nights data so not statistically significant
- However there is a logic to it. The ASV mode forces IPAP breaths immediately when it finds that you pause breathing versus the VAuto mode that waits longer before increasing IPAP
- I tried the AveoTSD tongue pulling device without my Bipap and it did not help at all. Plus it feels very strange to wear. If it did bump up my O2 levels I would use it
- @TechHippie - great suggestions on all your replies and I am conducting each of those experiments over the next 4 weeks
- I plan on increasing IPAP levels gradually every few days to see if the oxygen levels start going up. Definitely download the Sleep Lab Titration Guide that @Techhippe was referring. Google ResMed sleep Lab titration protocol
- I bought an 8 litre Oxygen concentrator and an oxygen bleed pipe to connect it to my Bipap. Should arrive in 2 weeks time and will begin using it to check results. I plan on testing it at lower levels before increasing it to see if it improves the o2 saturation
- I bought 3 different masks to experiment between full face and nasal options to see if that changes anything
- My prosomnus MAD is coming in 3 weeks so will add that in the experiments too
- Jay and TechHippie - Haven't tried a cervical collar but came across these studies that show promise - (1) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5695995/ (2) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7950809/
- Will research various options to try and experiment with
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - TechieHippie - 03-03-2024
That's a lot to try in a short time. I look forward to seeing your results! Pretty soon you'll be sharing your experiences with others.
You'll need to be careful to not make to many changes at once or too fast. Particularly with asv and oxygen. If you over oxygenate that can be a big problem with messing with blood gasses. Be careful and consult with professionals.
Most of these therapies take time. Your body didn't get this way overnight, so each change will have a ripple effect. (I'm guilty of going too fast myself.) So a few nights is often not enough of a test for any major change. (A little pressure change is okay but have someone knowledgeable here double check your ASV Oscar graphs before you add oxygen... It's a powerful device).
Much of your oxygen drops are going to be cumulative... Meaning they aren't just about the moment to moment breathing, they are also related to last week, last month, even the last years to an extent. I am not a doctor or health professional but my instinct with oxygen is start at .5 to 1.5 liter to find your minimum titration level and don't go up much more for at least few weeks. Your goal shouldn't be to have great numbers right away. Your goal is to stabilize over time to the least amount of intervention needed. Once you add oxygen, it's tricky to wean lower. Aim for a 96 average instead of 95; aim for less than 5 minutes under 90 at first rather than your current 25, but not 100 percent fixed for quite a while because then you will cause swing effects.
Also I've read that the more oxygen we use, the more our bodies age... Another support for getting the minimum titration you need to be healthy and functional.
Please consult with knowledgeable health professionals through this process, even if you are one. Also, assiduously log what you try and results so you aren't making mistakes and can' see longer term trends.
Good luck, I think you will make great progress.
Lisa
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - croc297 - 03-07-2024
TechieHippie Thank you for your comment "Dipping to 70 is likely harmful and dangerous to your health. You probably need to be on supplemental oxygen while you are figuring this out. I wouldn't delay in talking to your doctor about this. It's easy to feed oxygen into the BiPAP at night."
I extracted a couple oximeter reports and sent to my pulmonary physician (via their web portal) a couple days ago/along with voice mail but haven't heard back yet . If I don't hear back soon I will ask my primary care physician to assist motivating for an intervention as well. The numbers looked really low to me as well -- but I'm still relatively new to all this. Thanks again. Oscar has been a great place to pull the res med data and oximeter data all into one place -- plus ability to make my own journal notes.
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - UnicornRider - 03-08-2024
Dr.Gizmo, I am getting a moderator to assign you a therapy thread of your own.
bhavintu79 stay on this thread, from your other thread :
"Are there any Bipap devices that also have an attached pulse oximeter to measure oxygen saturation and report it. This could be helpful to see the oxygen sat data in sync with the bipap data on the same timeline
Are there any at home sleep study devices that show oxygen saturation, flow rate, AHI events, respiratory rate. Which ones would you recommend as the top at home sleep study devices? "
But for everyone who may be interested.
Wellue Oximeters can be downloaded to a PC or MAC via their O2 Insight Pro software/app.
From there it can be imported to OSCAR, where events for Pulse Change (PC) or SpO2 Drops (SD) will be flagged with other events
[attachment=60774]
From there you can zoom in to interesting features such as a Pulse Change Events (PC) and correlate them to Flow Rate disruptions, motion, O2 changes and Pulse
[attachment=60775]
From the Events tab, you can double click the Pulse Change listing to expand the listing to individual listings and select them for zoomed viewing.
[attachment=60779]
Which makes it really fast to chase Flow Rate distortions with an AHI of 0.00, and only PC and SD events to mark your area of interest.
I too suffer from O2 drops, you will notice from the first OSCAR Report with the "Details Tab" shown, I left the Checkme O2 Max Pulse/Oximeter on after the Bipap session ended and it recorded my O2 drop almost immediately without therapy pressure support.
There are Oximeter devices that attach to your ResMed and other *PAP machines but they are rather expensive ~$1000.00, the last I checked for Resmed. I will stick with my Wellue device.
The O2 Insight Pro report is nice to accompany your OSCAR Report when you approach your PCP for supplemental O2, the format gives a different perspective that my PCP was interested in.
.
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - RaghavGakhar - 07-14-2024
Hi, I am a fellow sleep apneatic. Were you able to solve this? Even my watch says less than 90% for a minute. I think my mouth opens at night and that is causing issues in my therapy. I get leak like 16-17 l/ min.
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - insomeapnea - 07-15-2024
Can you explain why "supplemental oxygen at night should be considered, especially for the short term?", I have Central Apneas and Congestive Heart Failure, so BiPav or VPap is not an option according to my doctor. If Supplemental Oxygen must be considered for "the short term," I am in trouble. Please clarify why.
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - Jay51 - 07-16-2024
Insomneapnea, Medicare will fund supplemental oxygen for a person with a cumulative 5 minutes or more of SPO2 during sleep below 88%. Supplemental oxygen can help keep SPO2 levels elevated more in individuals with pap therapy that is not accomplishing this.
It is important to keep SPO2 levels up during sleep to prevent hypoxia and other negative health issues. Showing PCP or another Dr. proof of this 5 minutes below 88% (usually from a sleep study) is a way to get the ball rolling towards obtaining supplemental oxygen.
I am not a Dr. but if you have already been diagnosed with Congestive Heart Failure, then this may be well worth your time looking into.
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - RaghavGakhar - 07-17-2024
Hi Jay, I have medical insurance but no insurance covers sleep apnea in India. Wish I was in USA to claim the insurance.
RE: Oxygen levels below 90% for 7% of night and below 94% for 34% inspite of Bipap - Jay51 - 07-17-2024
I am sorry to hear that RaghavGakhar. It seems like you are doing the best that you can though. Great job!