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+--- Thread: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? (/Thread-Airfit-p10-nasal-pillow-swap)
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Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - pcplus2 - 04-13-2017
Has anyone on the forum ever tried to organize or consider a nasal pillow swap initiative? It seems that the mask comes with all three sizes and I assume everyone only uses one size. Seems like lots of nasal pillows are just sitting in boxes or being thrown away and if we could organize a way to swap them people might benefit and save some $$$.
RE: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - Marillion - 04-13-2017
I'm not sure what Apnea Board policies on that would be so I will let the admins comment. But on the surface, it sounds to me like a good idea!
RE: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - chill - 04-13-2017
Sale, exchange, trading, etc of prescription supplies and equipment is not allowed.
RE: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - OpalRose - 04-13-2017
(04-13-2017, 04:35 PM)pcplus2 Wrote: Has anyone on the forum ever tried to organize or consider a nasal pillow swap initiative? It seems that the mask comes with all three sizes and I assume everyone only uses one size. Seems like lots of nasal pillows are just sitting in boxes or being thrown away and if we could organize a way to swap them people might benefit and save some $$$.
No, please go back and review forum rules.
3. No member may use their forum account to solicit or facilitate the sale, trade, or transfer of any prescription-required items (such as CPAP machines, humidifiers, masks or mask parts).* Soliciting or facilitating the sale, trade, or transfer of commercially-sold or pirated computer software packages or digital media is also prohibited.
RE: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - pcplus2 - 04-13-2017
If those are the rules, I understand and am happy to respect them. Just wondering why wrt pillows? If they aren't being used by you, seems a waste to just throw them out. I wasn't suggesting anyone make money off of them, just 'recycle' them so they aren't wasted. Doesn't seem out of line to me but maybe I'm missing something ...
RE: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - SuperSleeper - 04-13-2017
This really doesn't have to do with us just "making up" a rule, nor is it because we like being jerks.
I fully understand not wanting to waste CPAP mask parts, and your desire to help others with the extra parts is admirable.
That said, Apnea Board is based in the United States, and as such, we must comply with all U.S. laws and regulations.
In the U.S., selling, trading or transferring prescription-required items without a DME (Durable Medical Equipment) licence is technically illegal, and under current FDA regs & law, CPAPs, CPAP humidifiers, and CPAP masks are considered Class II medical devices, and as such, Apnea Board cannot be used to facilitate the sale of such prescription-required items. To do so would invite legal problems or possible FDA action against Apnea Board. In order to sell, trade or transfer a prescription-required item, one of the parties must be a licensed DME, and the receiving party must have a current prescription on file with that DME.
In the FDA regulations, in one place it seems to indicate that the individual parts that make up a Class II device (such as CPAP mask pillows, cushions or straps, etc) are considered to be an integral part of the device, and are also considered Class II devices (prescription-required). This is why many online DMEs require a prescription for even buying nasal pillows, for instance. Others don't require it. That's because in other places, the regs don't specifically say that the mark parts are "integral" to the CPAP system.
The regulations are not absolutely clear on this. In fact, on first glance, two separate sections appear to disagree with each other.
For instance, CPAP masks are definitely FDA Class II medical devices and are now prescription-required (this law changed several years ago). But some are saying that if they sell you all the parts separately that can be used to make up a complete mask, a prescription isn't required. I have my doubts as to the veracity of that conclusion, and an attorney who has helped Apnea Board in the past agrees that an attempt to skirt the regs by selling parts separately could potentially get the FDA involved legally. If FDA wanted to start enforcing the regs, they probably have enough wording in the current regs to justify the consideration of mask parts themselves to be integral parts of the masks and therefore prescription-required items. The thing is that they don't seem to be enforcing that right now... but they could at some point in the future.
In any case, Apnea Board is not a licensed DME and we are taking the safer route by not allowing the sale, trade or transfer of prescription-required CPAP masks on the forums, or the parts that make up those masks. We don't have the funds nor a team of attorneys to fight the FDA. So, we're not going to tempt fate nor risk the existence of Apnea Board over this particular issue.
Now, there are other forums that don't seem to care if they are used to by-pass the prescription laws, or they may have big enough pockets to fight a legal challenge if one comes. But Apnea Board operates on a shoestring budget, and if we're sued, we would likely have to close the doors here, since we have absolutely no money to pay for a legal fight in court or even pay for a lawyer to help us.
So, this has really nothing to do with us making up a stupid rule - it has everything to do with making sure we operate well inside of the U.S. laws and regulatory requirements so we can remain online, unmolested by legal challenges.
I wish we didn't have to have that rule, as I personally believe that even requiring a prescription for a CPAP machine is stupid. But we have no choice.
Hope that explains it a bit more.
RE: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - pcplus2 - 04-13-2017
Thanks for the explanation. Really appreciate all of the info/advice I have received here and wouldn't want to do anything to jeopardize it.
RE: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - SuperSleeper - 04-13-2017
(04-13-2017, 08:21 PM)pcplus2 Wrote: Thanks for the explanation. Really appreciate all of the info/advice I have received here and wouldn't want to do anything to jeopardize it.
No problem. I understand your desire to help others trade masks or mask parts. Makes perfect sense to me. Just can't do it here. We've had other members in the past who've desired to set up some type of website to do exactly what you're suggesting, but after checking out all the legal ramifications, they came to the conclusion that it just wasn't worth the all the effort, plus the personal legal risk - which is exactly why we don't do it here as well.
Now, if you personally want to help start a website to trade masks & mask parts, more power to 'ya. Just can't use Apnea Board to do it, or even help in the organization of such a venture. But if you do get one set up that works well, I'd be happy to recommend others to such a site.
RE: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - Cuppa - 04-13-2017
There are folk in the US, (whom I’m sure are not members here
), who advertise their spare masks on Australian eBay where they find buyers who are willing to save money this way as the cost of the items are so much higher over here even with postage costs included. We also have a buy, swap & sell Facebook page for all things CPAP, but I only just found that so am unsure how active it is.
I have no idea how sellers in the US stand legally doing this, but here we do not require a prescription for such things. Why anywhere requires a prescription for things like masks or replacement parts is beyond me, but if that’s the law then the forum owners would be foolish to take any different stand than Supersleeper has outlined.
RE: Airfit p10 nasal pillow swap? - TonyJ - 04-18-2017
(04-13-2017, 04:35 PM)pcplus2 Wrote: Has anyone on the forum ever tried to organize or consider a nasal pillow swap initiative? It seems that the mask comes with all three sizes and I assume everyone only uses one size. Seems like lots of nasal pillows are just sitting in boxes or being thrown away and if we could organize a way to swap them people might benefit and save some $$$.
Check your PM if you haven't already. Sent you a reply.