Going from a nasal mask to a full face mask
[parts of this thread were copied from our old forum]
Jan 2 2006, 12:35 PM Post #1
Has anyone every tried a full face mask. I can't get used to the nasal mask and was wondering if anyone has any idea what the pressure change should be.
In other words my sleep study resulted in a 9cm of pressure with a nasal mask, anybody now what pressure I would need for a full face mask?
btw, the only way I got through my sleep study was with ambien, that's how I got the nasal mask pressure.
Jan 2 2006, 05:47 PM Post #2
theoden, your CPAP will adjust to fit the full face mask, so that you will have 9 cm of pressure, whether you're using a full face mask or nasal mask. Keep in mind that full face masks have a lot more issues with leaks, so you'll have to experiment with it to get it right.
If it were me, I would try a nasal mask again... it does take some time to get used to, up to a month or so. Nasal masks leak less and are less obtrussive than full face masks.
good luck!
Jan 3 2006, 04:55 PM Post #3
Hi, I switched to a full face mask (Fisher & Paykel HP431) since I always end up with a stuffy nose at some point in the night. It was an absolute nightmare to adjust so it wouldn't leak and you can't scratch your nose when it itches or get a drink without taking it off, but I think I like it now. I've been using it for about 6 weeks. I'd suggest finding one that fits under your chin a little.
c
Jan 3 2006, 06:07 PM Post #4
Theoden, welcome to Apnea Board.
It's probably a good idea to be re-titrated once you change from a nasal interface to a full-face mask, unless you have an auto-titrating CPAP machine. Your pressure requirements may or may not change.
I've used the "Big Three" full-face masks, the F&P Flexi-Fit HC431, the Respironics Comfort Full, and the ResMed Ultra Mirage FF. For me, the Comfort Full provides the best seal, but that may be because of sizing differences...I take a Medium in the Comfort Full but a Large in the Ultra Mirage. Unfortunately, the CF has been de-engineered recently. Respironics has deleted the quick-release clips from the top two straps, meaning that the velcro has to be manually released and re-adjusted each time you wish to clean the mask. That's a huge drawback in my book. And with the CF, I usually wake up with the mask seal in my mouth. Again, that's probably a sizing issue.
I suspect that the Fisher-Paykel HC 431 is really made by Fisher-Price. It has a flimsy subjective "feel", and shares the new CF's lack of quick release clips on all headgear attachment points. A clumsy pull strap releases one attachment point, but only if you remember to pull straight forward, not out, a subtlety I was prone to forget, so I would be tugging forcefully but unable to release the clasp. When it does release, it is with a sharp crack which leads me to question the long-term durability of the plastic latch.
The HC431 is a one-size-fits all, only the silicone seal changes from one size to the next, and even then, the only difference is the size of the nose hole. In my experience, it is the most prone to mask leaks. Although the design of this mask provides for more chin support than the other two, it didn't prove to be a useful innovation in my case. My AHI was consistently worse with this mask than either of the other two.
I like the Ultra Mirage. It is well made, with four high quality, easy to release clips and wide headgear straps that are easier on your skin. I find it very comfortable as well. On the down side, it always leaks, but to be fair, my pressure requirements are pretty high. I had nights when the Comfort Full didn't leak at all, but never with the Ultra Mirage.
Remember, your mileage may vary! And whatever mask you try, it's important to give it a fair trial.
Good luck! Carl
"You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred." - Superchicken
Jan 5 2006, 03:00 PM Post #5
Hi Carl,
Isn't it interesting that we have had such a different experience with the F&P 431. I don't think it feels flimsy and I think the pull strap on the quick release clip is a great invention. I really like the way I can remove the headgear from the mask for cleaning without undoing my adjustments. But the absolute best thing about this mask is that I seldom have leaks now that I have the straps adjusted correctly. Maybe this difference is due to our pressures, I'm set at 11.
c
Jan 5 2006, 06:19 PM Post #6
Connie, welcome to Apnea Board.
Perhaps we're comparing different revisions of the mask. The HC431 that I have is about three months old. It only has one headgear attachment point with a quick release clip, opposed by a crude "hook" on the other side of the headgear. This assembly itself slides to and fro in a track on the front of the mask, which I found awkward.
The top headgear attachment points do not use quick release clips. Instead you must prise the straps in and out of their respective slots. This arrangement does not compare favorably to the positive action of a quick release such as the ones on the Ultra Mirage.
The headgear straps are also narrower on the HC431, which caused discomfort for me, probably because mine are pretty tight to combat leaks.
And as I mentioned, I often had trouble removing the headgear on the HC431 because I was not pulling the release strap forward at a ninety-degree angle. Overall I did not find this mask to have a "friendly" or robust design. I'm glad yours works well for you, though...that's what makes the world go around!
Carl
"You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred." - Superchicken
Jan 5 2006, 07:40 PM Post #7
Going from the nasal to the full face was my only alternative since I sleep with my mouth open. Hate chin straps. I use the Ultra Mirage and consider it to be the best mask I've tried. Leaks are a problem, but since I was changed to bi-level, it seems much better. I still have to strap it on pretty tight though because of my pressure being set at 22.
Jan 6 2006, 06:21 PM Post #8
you have a bi level? what is yourr exhale pressure or epap pressure, mine is 5cm, i just thought that was a little low, and wanted to compare it to others.
thanks in advance.
Jan 6 2006, 07:23 PM Post #9
Theoden,
My epap pressure was originally set to 8 but felt uncomfortable at that low setting. My current epap pressure is set to 15. I used cpap until I went to my current setting of 22, was always able to tolerate the higher pressure.
Quote:theoden wrote:
Jan 2 2006, 12:35 PM Post #1
Has anyone every tried a full face mask. I can't get used to the nasal mask and was wondering if anyone has any idea what the pressure change should be.
In other words my sleep study resulted in a 9cm of pressure with a nasal mask, anybody now what pressure I would need for a full face mask?
btw, the only way I got through my sleep study was with ambien, that's how I got the nasal mask pressure.
Quote:henry wrote:
Jan 2 2006, 05:47 PM Post #2
theoden, your CPAP will adjust to fit the full face mask, so that you will have 9 cm of pressure, whether you're using a full face mask or nasal mask. Keep in mind that full face masks have a lot more issues with leaks, so you'll have to experiment with it to get it right.
If it were me, I would try a nasal mask again... it does take some time to get used to, up to a month or so. Nasal masks leak less and are less obtrussive than full face masks.
good luck!
Quote:Connie Wrote:
Jan 3 2006, 04:55 PM Post #3
Hi, I switched to a full face mask (Fisher & Paykel HP431) since I always end up with a stuffy nose at some point in the night. It was an absolute nightmare to adjust so it wouldn't leak and you can't scratch your nose when it itches or get a drink without taking it off, but I think I like it now. I've been using it for about 6 weeks. I'd suggest finding one that fits under your chin a little.
c
Quote:ConnCarl Wrote:
Jan 3 2006, 06:07 PM Post #4
Theoden, welcome to Apnea Board.
It's probably a good idea to be re-titrated once you change from a nasal interface to a full-face mask, unless you have an auto-titrating CPAP machine. Your pressure requirements may or may not change.
I've used the "Big Three" full-face masks, the F&P Flexi-Fit HC431, the Respironics Comfort Full, and the ResMed Ultra Mirage FF. For me, the Comfort Full provides the best seal, but that may be because of sizing differences...I take a Medium in the Comfort Full but a Large in the Ultra Mirage. Unfortunately, the CF has been de-engineered recently. Respironics has deleted the quick-release clips from the top two straps, meaning that the velcro has to be manually released and re-adjusted each time you wish to clean the mask. That's a huge drawback in my book. And with the CF, I usually wake up with the mask seal in my mouth. Again, that's probably a sizing issue.
I suspect that the Fisher-Paykel HC 431 is really made by Fisher-Price. It has a flimsy subjective "feel", and shares the new CF's lack of quick release clips on all headgear attachment points. A clumsy pull strap releases one attachment point, but only if you remember to pull straight forward, not out, a subtlety I was prone to forget, so I would be tugging forcefully but unable to release the clasp. When it does release, it is with a sharp crack which leads me to question the long-term durability of the plastic latch.
The HC431 is a one-size-fits all, only the silicone seal changes from one size to the next, and even then, the only difference is the size of the nose hole. In my experience, it is the most prone to mask leaks. Although the design of this mask provides for more chin support than the other two, it didn't prove to be a useful innovation in my case. My AHI was consistently worse with this mask than either of the other two.
I like the Ultra Mirage. It is well made, with four high quality, easy to release clips and wide headgear straps that are easier on your skin. I find it very comfortable as well. On the down side, it always leaks, but to be fair, my pressure requirements are pretty high. I had nights when the Comfort Full didn't leak at all, but never with the Ultra Mirage.
Remember, your mileage may vary! And whatever mask you try, it's important to give it a fair trial.
Good luck! Carl
"You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred." - Superchicken
Quote:Connie Wrote:
Jan 5 2006, 03:00 PM Post #5
Hi Carl,
Isn't it interesting that we have had such a different experience with the F&P 431. I don't think it feels flimsy and I think the pull strap on the quick release clip is a great invention. I really like the way I can remove the headgear from the mask for cleaning without undoing my adjustments. But the absolute best thing about this mask is that I seldom have leaks now that I have the straps adjusted correctly. Maybe this difference is due to our pressures, I'm set at 11.
c
Quote:ConnCarl Wrote:
Jan 5 2006, 06:19 PM Post #6
Connie, welcome to Apnea Board.
Perhaps we're comparing different revisions of the mask. The HC431 that I have is about three months old. It only has one headgear attachment point with a quick release clip, opposed by a crude "hook" on the other side of the headgear. This assembly itself slides to and fro in a track on the front of the mask, which I found awkward.
The top headgear attachment points do not use quick release clips. Instead you must prise the straps in and out of their respective slots. This arrangement does not compare favorably to the positive action of a quick release such as the ones on the Ultra Mirage.
The headgear straps are also narrower on the HC431, which caused discomfort for me, probably because mine are pretty tight to combat leaks.
And as I mentioned, I often had trouble removing the headgear on the HC431 because I was not pulling the release strap forward at a ninety-degree angle. Overall I did not find this mask to have a "friendly" or robust design. I'm glad yours works well for you, though...that's what makes the world go around!
Carl
"You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred." - Superchicken
Quote:Mike N Wrote:
Jan 5 2006, 07:40 PM Post #7
Going from the nasal to the full face was my only alternative since I sleep with my mouth open. Hate chin straps. I use the Ultra Mirage and consider it to be the best mask I've tried. Leaks are a problem, but since I was changed to bi-level, it seems much better. I still have to strap it on pretty tight though because of my pressure being set at 22.
Quote:theoden wrote:
Jan 6 2006, 06:21 PM Post #8
Quote:Mike N
Jan 5 2006, 07:40 PM
Going from the nasal to the full face was my only alternative since I sleep with my mouth open. Hate chin straps. I use the Ultra Mirage and consider it to be the best mask I've tried. Leaks are a problem, but since I was changed to bi-level, it seems much better. I still have to strap it on pretty tight though because of my pressure being set at 22.
mike,
you have a bi level? what is yourr exhale pressure or epap pressure, mine is 5cm, i just thought that was a little low, and wanted to compare it to others.
thanks in advance.
Quote:Guest Wrote:
Jan 6 2006, 07:23 PM Post #9
Theoden,
My epap pressure was originally set to 8 but felt uncomfortable at that low setting. My current epap pressure is set to 15. I used cpap until I went to my current setting of 22, was always able to tolerate the higher pressure.
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