Mouth Breathing and Spontaneous Arousals

[Old Mike]

I just found an old roll of 25mm 3M Multipore tape in our first aid box. I've been experimenting with it and I think it will work as you suggested, since I think in my case it is more unintentional jaw drop than deliberate mouth breathing. Going to give it a go tonight anyway.

[Expat31]

@Apnea 23

Hi, I am curious about your reference to "custom flag" it's the first time I have seen this reference. What does this setting do?

Thanks a lot.

[Apnea23]

@Apnea 23

Hi, I am curious about your reference to "custom flag" it's the first time I have seen this reference. What does this setting do?

Thanks a lot.

Under preferences in Oscar you can enable 2 custom events which will automatically flag shorter but very real events that fall outside of the rigid 10 second rule for traditional apnea events.

So you can set it for example to flag 20% or 50% restrictive OHA/CA events for X seconds, and gain more insight at various stages of sleep to see if there's a more obvious pattern going on.

[Expat31]

Thanks, that's very interesting for me. Thought I knew just about all the possibilities in Oscar, got that wrong!

Many thanks again.

[Apnea23]

How did it go last night Mike?

Did the miracle happen?

[Old Mike]

Unfortunately, I discovered that the roll of tape I found had dried out and kept tearing as I tried to unroll it, so no go yet. I bought a new roll (35 mm) yesterday evening. Experimented with it while I was awake and reckon the beard may be an issue. Was too tired to bother with it when going to bed, but will have a go over the next couple of nights. I'll definitely let people here know next week how it goes.

Here's a strange aside though. I've been looking back over my Oscar data and notice that the mouth breathing has gotten worse over the last few weeks - it was always there to some extent though. What's interesting is that there is a correlation between it and dieting/weight loss. I had put on some extra weight over the winter months (BMI would have me overweight but not obese, although getting there!). I started a fairly restricted diet in mid-February (discussed with my doctor first) and have lost some 14-15 lbs. I'm also exercising more (just walking - but doing about 45 mins daily). The weight loss is particularly noticeable around my neck area. Perhaps changes in physiology are a factor. But, regardless, I reckon mouth taping is probably a healthier option than getting fat again!

[Expat31]

@Mike

You should really look at these videos on mouth leaks and tape. I think it just about "covers". everything.


https://youtu.be/1SlOLPR81X4

https://youtu.be/IG007EFmk8w

https://youtu.be/oq5pJQJPu0w

[Old Mike]

Ah, it's Jason! I haven't seen those videos before though. Makes me fear that my beard will be a problem, but hey nothing to lose, so going to try it anyway. I just did an interesting experiment while awake this morning to see if I could replicate the flow rate patterns I see when my leak rate increases. I could easily replicate the "exhale puffing" which I certainly do quite a lot. That gives a leak rate of about 15 l/min. But anytime I tried to fully mouth breath, I just spluttered (like Jason) and got a messy flow rate pattern. Of course, it's possible that during REM sleep, the semi-paralysis which occurs results in a different breathing pattern when mouth breathing than when awake. I'm going try to post a segment of what I think was a mouth breathing episode from last night.

[Old Mike]

Here's a short segment of what I think was a mouth breathing episode from last night. The breathing pattern is very different to that of exhale puffing but also  has a much sharper exhale than normal asleep nasal breathing. What intrigues me is that it is very "clean" and consistent and went on for some thirty minutes without waking me. I've tried to replicate it while awake but cannot. My only explanation is that REM sleep changes the way the the throat/mouth behaves compared to when awake. The giveaway that it's some type of mouth breathing is the combination of leak rate and low tidal volume.

   

[Apnea23]

Unfortunately, I discovered that the roll of tape I found had dried out and kept tearing as I tried to unroll it, so no go yet. I bought a new roll (35 mm) yesterday evening. Experimented with it while I was awake and reckon the beard may be an issue. Was too tired to bother with it when going to bed, but will have a go over the next couple of nights. I'll definitely let people here know next week how it goes.

Here's a strange aside though. I've been looking back over my Oscar data and notice that the mouth breathing has gotten worse over the last few weeks - it was always there to some extent though. What's interesting is that there is a correlation between it and dieting/weight loss. I had put on some extra weight over the winter months (BMI would have me overweight but not obese, although getting there!). I started a fairly restricted diet in mid-February (discussed with my doctor first) and have lost some 14-15 lbs. I'm also exercising more (just walking - but doing about 45 mins daily). The weight loss is particularly noticeable around my neck area. Perhaps changes in physiology are a factor. But, regardless, I reckon mouth taping is probably a healthier option than getting fat again!

Same happened with me after 30lbs loss - from 195lbs to 165lbs. Therapy went haywire, more leaks, wake-arousals, farting/burping. Each pressure increase APAP provided induced more leaking, more issues, less effective therapy.

I have been experimenting with fixed pressures for the past few weeks but only mouth taping for about 4 nights.

Now that I'm mouth taping with 0 leaks (I mean *zero*) I may revert to APAP actually, to see if with zero leaks my therapy can be completely effective on APAP.