Not using your therapy until you purchase equipment cleaning machine

[SarcasticDave94]

As if we didn't already know, there are staunch supporters on both sides of this issue. There will always be those that lean towards buying SoClean and those that will not buy. Both sides believe their answer is right, and given a certain set of reasons, both actually could be right in backing their choice.

Those that do buy it are allowed to do so. I personally won't buy SoClean. What I do is (hopefully) explain why I won't most times this subject rears its head again. I offer my opinion and then that's it for me. I let the individual decide if they want to invest or not in SoClean.

Having said that, I'm in bystander mode hereafter on this thread.

[PoolQ]

so lets be clear, okay. We now have people that have bought this product actually feeling like they need to explain things that they don't like about it so they don't perhaps get slammed about buying it. Really?

Look the point of the other appliances was you can wash and dry all of your stuff by hand, people have done it for decades at least. This is just like you can wash your CPAP equipment by hand. THE SAME THING.
Most if not all of us (well except for the poor) have bought dish washers, washing machines, and dryers so we don't have to wash everything by hand and give us time to go do other things. This is exactly what I do with the SoClean. THE SAME THING.

I am very tired of people, strangers, telling me (us) that SoClean has separated FOOLS from their money. That we have fallen for a scam. Basically that we are ignorant. That we cannot decide for ourselves what we want to buy with our own money, for our own reasons. So thank you all so very much for getting in such a twist about a stupid product. I fail to understand why this group is such a great group of people for everything but this one subject and then it becomes a contest to see who can demean a group of customers the most?

If someone can explain, not about the product, but about the reaction to it and why it seems that all common decency gets tossed out the window it would be appreciated. Notice I am not asking for an explanation as to why you are "right" to do so I am asking "why" with this product it's okay to call someone a fool or other niceties.

For me I am done, I will not (if I can help it) ever post to a soclean thread again and if I feel like it I will continue to "ignore" posters that I personally feel are insulting for no reason. I left the other board for this very reason (not the soclean) and I thought that people here were helpful and considerate, not the type to demean anyone for any reason. I hope I was not mistaken. Peace

[PoolQ]

As if we didn't already know, there are staunch supporters on both sides of this issue. There will always be those that lean towards buying SoClean and those that will not buy. Both sides believe their answer is right, and given a certain set of reasons, both actually could be right in backing their choice.

Those that do buy it are allowed to do so. I personally won't buy SoClean. What I do is (hopefully) explain why I won't most times this subject rears its head again. I offer my opinion and then that's it for me. I let the individual decide if they want to invest or not in SoClean.

Having said that, I'm in bystander mode hereafter on this thread.

Exactly, Thank you Dave! This time I am not being  sarcastic and am right there with you!

[mesenteria]

...

If someone can explain, not about the product, but about the reaction to it and why it seems that all common decency gets tossed out the window it would be appreciated. Notice I am not asking for an explanation as to why you are "right" to do so I am asking "why" with this product it's okay to call someone a fool or other niceties.

...

I'll give it a try. 


This is a discussion forum.  It's a place to exchange both experience and ideas.   Some ideas and experience will be at odds with others shared here.  People are free to post and to disagree, even to challenge, what others have said.  It happens on every forum that some people will object not only to what has been said, but also to how it was tendered.

We, each of us, have to interpret words.  We can't make them up legitimately; we can only interpret what is actually placed before us and in the order presented (syntax).  When the syntax is unconventional, ambiguous, distorted, contrarian, apparently non-factual, overtly erroneous, or so limited in scope as to render it vastly reduced in applicability or relevance, there is sure to be some blow-back.  That, in my opinion, apparently shared, seems to have happened here.

Dishwashers are what they are, and they do an obvious, consistent, and reliable job, and that demonstrably.  Our PAP machines cannot be serviced by us internally, so we cant determine the degree of soiling of the impeller blades, whether-or-not axles and other inner surfaces are covered in dust, and we can't determine how pathological the surfaces are.  We can guess, but that's as good as it gets...a guess.  We can see how clean and usable our clothing, cutlery, and crockery are when their cleaning appliances are done with them.  Not so the SoClean.

I think, and it's just my opinion (speaking only for myself), that a responsible adult should know to turn over rocks.  She should know to go online and do some rudimentary fact-finding.  Just as most of us know how to shop for the best prices (who pays MSRP for anything these days?), and to compare brands and models to ensure we're not buying a mistake, people should know enough not to be swayed to part with money on devices that promise to relieve us of any form of drudgery.  As one economist said, I wish I could remember her name, we, as a society should stop buying things we think will make our lives 'easier'.  But it doesn't follow that we should all go back to walking everywhere, washing clothing, growing our own food, making our own footwear, and doing other things that machines have proven they can do more efficiently.

The SoClean machine is not going to do a substantially better job, for its cost, and for the time it takes to do the job, than the average person can do for himself inside of three minutes. Since we're not privy to any objective data that demonstrates its true efficacy, or even that a person should cease to use their machine in the meantime until they get one (for gawd's sake!!!...really!!!), few of us are inclined to accept it's claims on principle, at face value, or in good will.  Further, it's an orientation we would commend to others who can be bothered to do a little thinking on the topic.

[PoolQ]

Mesenteria.
1. I have zero problem with hearing what others think of something. Notice the focus on "something". I do have a problem when other focus on how others made a decision or what others think of decisions. especially when expressed in the strong negative and questioning their intelligence
2. the blow back has been going on since the SoClean hit the market and only getting worse.
3. my post about dishwashers was sarcastic in the extreme, I guess some people missed that, others did not.
4. and again I got a nice tutorial how responsible people should evaluate products. I understand that the heart is in the right place, but explaining how "responsible" people "should" do things implies that some involved in the evaluation of the SoClean are not responsible people and do not understand how to evaluate products. I personally think that people on this forum are quite a bit above average and that everyone here does know how to evaluate products. That if anything they are coming here to gain insight into things that they do not have a background in. Being able to evaluate a product is different from knowing everything about anything. So far while I have been reading here, while I may have questioned it at times, I have never ready anyone posting about how to evaluate products.

5. I guess there are different meanings to "clean". In one sense the SoClean does not "clean" anything. For a consumer product IMHO it does a reasonable job of sanitizing my CPAP. I do not consider it to "clean" my CPAP. SoClean is not a word it is a product name. "So clean" is two words and means something completely different than SoClean.


6. I understand what you are saying about dishwashers, however this is not close to what I was trying to say. We chose to spend money on what WE think is important and useful. My thinking that the SoClean is useful to me has NOTHING to do with what others may think about the product. It's my money, my choice and I am happy with it. The corollary to "a fool and their money" is "penny wise, pound foolish" both of these encourage people to not be fools/foolish and both completely discount any legitimate reason someone might have had for doing something. These are typically used for talking with children and not reasonable, responsible adults


7. as for "substantially better" I might suggest that using machines for laundry and dishes do not necessarily do a better job than competent people have been doing for decades. I do not think that we buy those machines because we don't think that we are doing a good enough job by hand. The manufacturers may want us to think that, but no I do not think that this is the case most times.

Well then there is your last paragraph that assumes so much, or lack thereof on my part. There is objective data on both the SoClean AND ozone sanitization in general. For consumer products it is just fine. As for using their machines to wait for the SoClean is one person opinion and not a claim by the company. Personally I don't think they should have used this quote simply because it makes the company look suspect. Perhaps did not need to be said "bothered to do a little thinking on the topic." I totally agree that NO ONE here is just "inclined to accept it's claims on principle, at face value, or in good will"

This forum is not a place where too many people go that cannot be bothered by a little thinking, they are here precisely because they have found the need to think and to acknowledge that they need more information. The biggest think, I think that can be said about the SoClean is that NO ONE "NEEDS" one of these


Well it looks like I could not totally stay away from this topic, but that is because of your well reasoned response

one thing I do not understand is "people should know enough not to be swayed to part with money on devices that promise to relieve us of any form of drudgery". personally I would never buy anything based solely on a manufacturers claim, but if I believed that it would relieve personal drudgery, why yes I would buy it. I want to remove as much drudgery from my life as possible. What did I miss?

[Walla Walla]

The horse is dead.

[PoolQ]

The horse is dead.

I don't think we are talking about the horse anymore. we are talking about communications that show respect and accepting the other persons side without having to agree with it.

[Walla Walla]

[OpalRose]

The horse is dead.

I don't think we are talking about the horse anymore. we are talking about communications that show respect and accepting the other persons side without having to agree with it.

PoolQ,
Did anyone here attack you “personally”? I’ve read through this a few times, and didn’t see it.

Please try to remember that this forum welcomes back and forth discussion as long as no one is personally attacked. And it is to be expected that there will be disagreements and a difference of opinions.

This would be a mighty boring place if we all felt the same about a subject.

[mesenteria]

"...As for using their machines to wait for the SoClean is one person opinion and not a claim by the company. Personally I don't think they should have used this quote simply because it makes the company look suspect..."

Who paid for the advertising, the people making statements or the company that hopes to profit from them?

It's really quite straightforward.  The company used them as agents for their purposes.  By including the statements, in whole or in part, the company's intent was to attempt to garner more patronage.