Central vs Obstructive Apnea - EERS Device and Trial

[Sleeprider]

The Philips FitLife mask is impossible with bilevel therapy. I got one to use for a surgery that microplaned the skin off my nose for rhinophyma complications of rosacea. By the second day, I was back on the P10 as the fitlife flexed in and out on every breath and leaked like a sieve.

[ChadBSr]

@seepak, where are the vents on your mask? Nose, cheek, elbow?  The further away from your nose the more dynamic dead space.

It seems I need too much dead space for any mask to make a difference.

I think eventually someone will develop a calculation for needed dead space based on an individuals ideal tidal volume.
The one study mentions wanting to develop a mask that reads co2 and auto adjusts.  94% reduction of CSA and OSA. That's pretty wild.

Yes, this is another confirmation that Patrick's "breathe deep, breathe slow" is good practice.

[UsuallyTired]

Chad

Very interesting thanks for all the information.
 I have followed Patrick McKeown since July of last year and I've been doing hypercapnic training ever since and it's changed my physical being.

As far as the full face mask goes that's also very interesting and for some reason it's working for me right now and I'll keep you posted if things change.

SeePak, could you elaborate on the McKeown/hypercapnic training? Which exercises, how often, and most importantly the effects you've seen and anything you've learned along the way. I'm very interested but am reticent to invest the time & effort without knowing more about it.

[SeePak]

@chad
vent holes on dreamwear are on face of the mask, below nose
vent holes on Mirage Activa LT are at the elbow
trying mirage again tonite, i had full face mask by mistake last night, will try nasal

@usually tired

I can give example of one and name of other

briefly
walk for 10 paces holding your nose, then walk 30 sec breathing normally, repeat 5 times
Breathing needs to come from the diaphragm, ribs expand on inhale type thing
CO2 is air hunger, feeling of needing more air
However, this is an acquired taste!
Once you get over the mental part of the air hunger, you are on your way!

Sharkfit is the other exercise, which is more grueling, until your body/mind adapts.

Wearing a pulse oximeter and after a few weeks of your body adapting, O2 will drop down to maybe 90% or a bit lower.
Your body makes changes, adapts,
Spleen holds blood, and releases hemoglobin that better carries O2 when you get to this state.
So your blood and cells and brain are flooded with oxygen (my words)

I enjoy the feeling of air hunger now, it feels good knowing and seeing my oxygen at 99% once exercise is done and resting.

You really need to read up on this, there is so much there, seriously!
Patrick cured himself of Asthma and i believe his Sleep Apnea is much less.

Thats what i am hoping to do as well with the Sleep Apnea.

I have been doing this since July/2024 and really starting now to practice and exercise more.

Also, it is important to relax with the mind and body during air hunger.

The main issue that is being addressed with all this is Hyperventilating, which according to Patrick and others is a major epidemic.

Read up, better to hear it from Patrick himself.

and he makes tons of videos for all this too. check out the internet.

going to bed now, if still interested, tomorrow i could find a few choice videos to link you to.

[churras]

Do you have any links? Or the full name of Patrick? I can't find him on youtube

[SeePak]

Churras

Patrick McKeown

[ChadBSr]

Patrick McKeown Oxygen Advantage or Buteyko Clinic International

I made notes on the 4 phenotypes that effect sleep breathing disorder and methods to improve each:

1) Pharyngeal critical closing pressure (Pcrit): Measures how likely the airway is to collapse during sleep

Nasal breathing, breathe low, cpap, surgery

2) Loop gain: A measure of respiratory control instability

Nasal breathing, breath hold, breathe light, breathe slow, EERS

3) Upper airway recruitment: A phenotype of sleep apnea

Nasal breathing, breathe light, myo therapy, didgeridoo, EERS

4) Arousal threshold: A measure of how likely someone is to wake up if their airway narrows 

Nasal breathing, breathe low, breathe slow



Breathe low means using your diaphragm. Mouth breathing breathes in the chest and doesn't fill the lungs. Breathe slow means slow enough to be silent.

[SeePak]

Patrick's work started with the BUTEYKo method so it doesn't really matter however I use Patrick which includes that anyway

[UsuallyTired]

ChadBSr, 
That's a great summary. Thanks. 

SeePak, 
Thanks for sharing the exercises. Yes, I would appreciate any links/resources, and has it made any difference for you at this point? You seem to be excited by it. So, are you seeing any results reflected in your CPAP/OSCAR or elsewhere? 

I have read a bit of McKeown's work, but I didn't know where to start and if it was worth diving deeper. Both of your comments have been helpful to that end. Thank you. 

 

[SeePak]

link for Patrick McKeown, Oxygen Advantage

https://www.youtube.com/@OxygenAdvantage

Anything you need could be found there.
'Shut your mouth and change your life', 1st video on the list on that site. Probably good place to start. Go from there.


I have watched so many videos, i could go forever finding the links and pasting .

Start here, you should be able to get all you need.

Everyone is different in how they determine what to watch , what to believe, what to try etc.

I know many folks here that could care less about what Patrick says or does.

You can lead a horse to water, but cant make 'em drink!

For me, it was very obvious that the science was there.

And it was worth trying out.

Get the Oxygen Advantage app for android or apple for your phone.
From the website...
https://oxygenadvantage.com/oa-breathing-app/

That is what i am using daily.

what has it done for me? 
No more Anxiety or Stress, or if/when it comes on, i just concentrate on breathing, using Patrick's method.
Procrastination, almost gone, or very little, and when it happens, again, back to some breathing exercises.
Creativity.  Not sure how this is related, but i know it is, cause i am feeling it!
I am not out of breath like i used to be, though now i realize i was not out of breath, I was full of CO2 'Air Hunger', and that can be controlled!
Started breathing thru nose ALL the time, that is simple enough, just do it!
I feel great thru most of the day, though get tired later in day.
Hoping i find the right recipe or time allows me to get my sleep back, will see.
Not there yet.
But i am not waiting for the magic PAP machine recipe, thats for sure.
So many on this site complain about still feeling tired and AHI <1 !

Exercise is the key!
Gotta get the CO2 flowin'.
That leads to more blood oxygen and oxygen to your cells.
It is really that simple, with one modification...
NOSE BREATHE  LSD , Light Slow and Deep ( using diaphragm)

I could probably go on and on, but i Know it is not productive for anyone who has not watched any videos, or read any literature.

When you do, I will be glad to help as much as I can with questions and answers, no problem.


good luck!