[Equipment] Is there a way to tell whether this anti snoring device is treating my sleep apnea?

[nico08]

Hi. I've tried to use a CPAP machine in the past. I used different masks as well as a chin strap. I've tried adjusting the CPAP settings. I have not figured out a way to use the CPAP on a consistent basis. I've also been fitted for a dental appliance, a TAP3. by a dentist. I've recorded my sleep while using the TAP3 and I am still snoring throughout my sleep.

So most recently I purchased the following anti snore mouthpiece- The Pacifier Tongue Retention Breathing Night Sleep Aid.  It looks to be the type of product that I may be able to use on a consistent basis. I won't know for sure until I give it a test run. In addition to that product. I also purchased a pulse oximeter. I checked the sleep study that was done on me a few years ago and it looks like my oxygen level stayed above 90% for the majority of the test period. Although at some point it dipped down to 86% . Although the at-home sleep study I did prior to the sleep lab sleep study, showed that my average oxygen saturation during the at-home study was between 93 and 95 percent but that it reached a low of 76 percent which lasted for 50 seconds. (Can that low number be accurate? I kind of questioned the accuracy of the at-home study.)

I understand that some people can have sleep apnea even though they do not snore. But I also understand that if you snore you more likely have sleep apnea too. I guess what I'm trying to do is figure out what will show that this new anti snore mouthpiece is effective not just in regard to snoring but also in regard to sleep apnea.

I can check for snoring by recording my sleep, I have an app on my phone for that. I can use the oximeter during my sleep as well, and record the data throughout the night, to see if my oxygen levels are staying at a healthy level while I'm wearing the anti snoring mouthpiece. I guess my question is, aside from using the anti snore mouthpiece in a formal sleep study, which is not affordable or practical for me at this point in time, is there any other way (aside from the oximeter and the recording) to determine whether the anti snore mouthpiece is effectively treating the sleep apnea that I have. The only other thing I can think of assessing is how I feel upon awaking, whether the sleep I have while using the anti snore mouthpiece,  is restful.  But I feel like that assessment may be a bit too subjective. Thank you for your insight.

[TBMx]

I might be totally mistaken but is the "treatment" not all about "how do you feel the next day?"

AHI / RDI / ODI .... or whatever ... who cares?
what really counts is: do you feel rested? does it help you? do you get (in a good way) thorugh the day?

what else is there to determine?

[PaulaO2]

It will take some studying.

Use the oximeter without the mouthpiece for several nights. At least 3, perhaps as many as 7. This will give you trends, averages, etc.

Then use the oximeter with the mouthpiece for at least as many nights.

Try to keep what you do during the day of both sets of tests the same. Don't try any new foods or introduce new stressors. Don't start a new medication. Try to go to bed at about the same time and get up at same time but keep your usual routine. You want to cut down as many variables as possible.

Compare the data.

Most anti-snoring devices don't work to stop apnea events, especially those sold over the counter or online without a prescription. Our mouths and situations are not generic. The idea behind them is to pull or place the tongue far forward and remove as much material from vibrating as your breathe. The tongue and throat muscles are voluntary muscles, meaning we control them. So as we fall asleep, they relax just like our arms and legs do. For some people, as these muscles relax, they and the tissue around them vibrate as we breathe. This is the snore. The more these tissues and stuff relax, they start to come closer together until they slap closed. This is an obstructive apnea event. Our brain starts screaming for us to wake up. We jerk, regain control over our muscles, and the airway opens. The AHI states how many times an hour this happens. These tissues include the tongue, back and front of throat, palate, and even some of the sinus tissues if they are large enough. It also includes fat around the neck which is why big necked men are the stereotype for OSA.


So pulling the tongue forward may or may not reduce OSA events. It isn't going to help with the rest of the tissues and fat. It will eliminate a chunk of it, sure, but not all of it.

Because we are not breathing, the oxygen in our blood can drop. For some people, it drops quickly and far. For others, it doesn't drop as fast. And yes, it is possible to have an blood oxygen reading of 76 for 50 seconds.

Normal people have sleeping oxygen rates of 92% and above. Even 90% and above can be acceptable. Below that, however, indicates something is wrong. Our bodies need that oxygen at night in order to rest and recuperate. Without it, we don't do either.

[PaulaO2]

I might be totally mistaken but is the "treatment" not all about "how do you feel the next day?"

AHI / RDI / ODI .... or whatever ... who cares?
what really counts is: do you feel rested? does it help you? do you get (in a good way) thorugh the day?

what else is there to determine?

Because we get too used to feeling tired, a lot of us didn't know how tired we were until we found our best treatment pressures and settled into it. That is why the data is so important along with how we feel.

[nico08]

Thank you for the helpful information. Im particular, I like the idea about reducing the variables, so I can see whether the mouthpiece is having any positive impact on the snoring and/or sleep apnea. If I have low oxygen level readings without the mouthpiece, and healthy oxygen levels with the mouthpiece, can I assume that the mouthpiece is improving/eliminating the sleep apnea condition?

I figure if I can't make a cpap machine work for me, nor a custom fitted oral appliance, the anti snoring mouthpiece may at least reduce the sleep apnea to some limited degree, which is better than where I would be, using nothing else when I sleep.

[Russatrice]

What is the problem with making the CPAP work for you? Isn't it a better idea to work out a solution for that if your concerned about treatment for your sleep apnea (which you should be). This is the best place for getting help with adjusting to CPAP treatment, you wouldn't be the first one that thought it will never work for them but eventually, with the right settings and mask, they get used to it. Do you still have a CPAP or what happened that you stopped using it?

[ajack]

lack of oxygen isn't the only reason we arouse during sleep from sleep apnea, you can have good o2 and still need a cpap.

I found it took 7 weeks before I was able to sleep through. I found adjusting to cpap hard work, but it does happen in the end.

there is only one trick..keep the mask on.

If for any reason you are going to take it off, ich, scratch etc. Sit up with your feet on the ground. this stops you falling back to sleep without the mask.
Put it on and set up the machine while you watch TV. If I were doing it again, I'd use lower pressures 6-8 to help acclimatise first and then the proper pressure for the AHI when I was tolerating cpap.

[PaulaO2]

Nico08, I think you are missing the point of treating sleep apnea. Just like with any other condition, the effects are accumulative. While you have have nights where the O2 sat rate stays above 90% and nights where it does not, it is those "does not" nights that are slowly killing you. One organ, one body system, one tired piece at a time. And sleep apnea will kill you. If not properly treated, it will kill you.

I encourage you to give CPAP another try. I don't know why you couldn't. If you explained here on the forum, I missed it or don't remember. If you haven't explained, start another thread and we'll walk you through it.

[nico08]

Hey Paula. Thank you for your response. CPAP is horrible for me. I get very little quality sleep when I gave a good faith effort to use in in the past. It scares me to know that I am going to die sooner because the treatment options available for sleep apnea are horrible.

I have tried a nasal pillow/mouth mask and a nasal mask. Neither works for me.

I am a mouth breather and I have tried to use a chin strap with the nasal mask. The strap inevitably falls off. My nasal passages are typically blocked, so the whole set up just doesnt work for me.

The nasal pillow/mouth mask doesnt work for me. i hate the feeling of having a mask on my face, i am claustrophic and the masks make me feel trapped.

it takes me forever to fall asleep with the masks on. 

I have tried to ramp up to appropriate pressure, tried auto cpap, and it doesnt help.

I move around at night and I can never keep the mask on for long while i am sleeping. And because dislike it so much, when it falls off during sleep, I make no effort to get it back on.

I wake up gasping for air.

The prescription oral appliance doesnt stay in my mouth. It hurts my jaws, makes my mouth super dry, and my tongue cant be in a natural position with it on.

i cant believe that researchers have not found a better treatment option for this condition. 

my oncologist noticed that my tonsils were very enlarged the last time I had a check up with him. I know that surgical options do not have the highest success rates, but I am thinking that may be the only real option that I have now.

[silversnore]

Check out Inspire therapy.  

"Inspire therapy is a breakthrough implantable treatment option for people with Obstructive Sleep Apnea who are unable to use or get consistent benefit from Continuous Positive Airway Pressure (CPAP). While you’re sleeping, Inspire monitors every breath you take. Based on your unique breathing patterns, the system delivers mild stimulation to the hypoglossal nerve which controls the movement of your tongue and other key airway muscles. By stimulating these muscles, the airway remains open during sleep.

The Inspire obstructive sleep apnea device is controlled by a small handheld sleep remote. The remote allows you to turn Inspire therapy on before bed and off when you wake up, increase and decrease stimulation strength, and pause during the night if needed."

Its kind of like a pace maker for OSA.  Seems bizarre, however another solution for you to research!!

Think it ok to post this link:  https://www.inspiresleep.com/