[News] RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS

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It is an image from this video with AirSense 10 For Her

GrantsReviews

Found it. My report coming.

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OK Lacking a unit to take apart I only can go by my eyes as I watch the Utube video of a taking apart of a Resmed unit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9jdc9_WmwM

I have been told Resmed uses the same fan in all of their units…

SADDLY  there is no getting around this: THIS IS WORST in my option that the Phillips system.

The Phillips system has the foam inside an air chamber, BUT it is off to the side so that air is NOT forced through it. I think it is there to lower air flow noise, not to filter it.

Speaking of filters we REALLY need to replace the air intake filters every month, they are somewhat similar and on the older System One the big foam filter in them are very much like this stuff…  

Resmed’s fan in set up so that air seems to have no way but to go through their foam, I suspect it is an air cleaner filter. Even if it does not breath though the foam it is RIGHT there next to the air passage.

Talking with Jeff a service tech he gladly opened up a fan and found the foam….the problem is when they service these units they replace the whole fan assembly and do not need to open them. So being told that Resmed does not have foam was honest by what they have seen. He was as surprised as all of us.

I asked if the foam is structural as in helping hold the fan motor and he thinks it is, so there is a more likely chance to be a problem removing it as it just might be needed to keep the fan in place.

Where the foam inserts in the Phillips machines are NOT structural and does not hold anything in place so removing it will only seemly allow a little more noise.

AT THIS POINT I personally feel the Phillips machine are the better setup as removing their foam does not seem to affect the systems in any way in its performance.

I cannot say the same for the resmed system.

My second night on my no foam machine was again great.

Rich

PS I canceled my Resmed order. I feel I may have saved my self from the fire, I am better off staying in the pan.

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[buddy0329]

Resmed statement on the front page of their website:

Information regarding a separate manufacturer’s product recall (June 2021)

Of note:  

Is ResMed affected by the other manufacturer’s June 2021 recall?

No. ResMed devices are not subject to the other manufacturer’s June 2021 recall and are safe for patients to use.

Are ResMed devices safe to use?

Yes, all ResMed devices are safe to use and are not subject to the other manufacturer’s June 2021 recall. Patient safety is ResMed’s most important goal. We have not observed the issues that the other manufacturer is reporting with its devices; ResMed devices use different material.

[racprops]

Resmed statement on the front page of their website:

Information regarding a separate manufacturer’s product recall (June 2021)

Of note:  

Is ResMed affected by the other manufacturer’s June 2021 recall?

No. ResMed devices are not subject to the other manufacturer’s June 2021 recall and are safe for patients to use.

Are ResMed devices safe to use?

Yes, all ResMed devices are safe to use and are not subject to the other manufacturer’s June 2021 recall. Patient safety is ResMed’s most important goal. We have not observed the issues that the other manufacturer is reporting with its devices; ResMed devices use different material.

Well I for one will not trust them, my eyes see a foam in their fan housings...looks like the same kind of stuff, AND It seems to be even more in the air flow in or out of the fan.

Phillips system the foam is NOT made to breathe though it, I cannot say the same for the ResMed.

I KNOW all chemically made stuff all out gas and will dry up and decompose the ONLY question is when?? How long until it is bad.

I KNOW I can safely remove the foam from my Phillips machine and do not see any effect from its removal.

So for now I will stick to my modified Phillips Dreamstation.

Rich

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My report is based on what I can see and on the help of a service tech whom opened a ResMed fan motor housing.

I cannot say for sure that removing the foam ring from the ResMed unit will affect its operation, but any unit I am to buy will be under warranty so I CANNOT open it and remove the foam, nor can anyone do so unless all warranty is passed or any warrante will be voided.

With my Phillips machine they are 100% out of warranty so I am free to do with my machine anything I want.

As for ResMed saying the foam is safe...well so had Phillips for how many years?? The question is Do you feel lucky?? Do you trust them??

Rich

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The video show all...

I used duct tape as it is not a lot of glue, only the sticky part....until I can research for a 100% save food grade glue that will work on the plastic use in the housing.

One change I will be going back in and using a larger piece of duct tape so there is more area holding to the housing.

Rich

[WakeUpTime]

How will Philips actually respond to each recalled product?
Send it to a distribution repair center for modification?

The backlog created by 3-4M users would be enormous.  The health consequences for most for being without their CPAP/BiPAP machines for days/weeks would also be significant.  They've also told users to stop using their medical devices immediately.  They'll therefore all want replacements immediately.

They might have a starting group of replacement machines and then use the returned-and-later-modified machines to replace future  returned units.  That can't be a quick turnaround as they might need to create new refurbished serial numbers, etc.  Also, there were be a significantly mismatched replacement floater inventory as it would be extremely difficult to match all the various categories of recalled machines:
- System One CPAP
- System One BiPAP
- DreamStation BiPAP
- etc. 

I suppose they'll therefore replace older machines with a newer (and possibly refurbished) equivalent, within the same category.  It will then, of course, need to have all its settings reprogrammed -- by an authorized provider likely.  There might be re-training too needed on a newer machine.  

This would seem to be a logistics nightmare.  I imagine what they're after now is an initial assessment of the number of impacted parties and machine types.

If I were Philips, I'd give people the option of having a credit for their recalled product to use on another new machine, based on the pro-rated value of their existing design-flawed unit.

[OMyMyOHellYes]

I wonder - of the folks that are apoplectic over this - to my recall, PR's first major PAP recall - and bash PR - do they ever drive or ride in an automobile....  

Guess there was no comparison to the recall rate of auto manufacturers.  Oooo !!!  Oooo!!! Mr. Kotter!!! Mr. Kotter !!!!

Or airplanes and bothered to dig out the AD history of those particular aircraft.

Yeah.....

Me?  I celebrated the recall by buying a bright new shiny PR DS2.  FedUp dropped it today so tonight will be the first glorious use.  (And I've used both PR and Resmeg machines over the years.  The only Resmeg units I'd care for are the S8 series - still my travel machine).  Yep.  Call me a PR fanboy.  Two fully functional, low hour S9s sitting on a closet shelf unused...  Never had any interest in jumping on the S10 bandwagon.

PR's actions are, IMNSHO, admirable: saying "We messed up, and we'll work through something to make it right.  You  are frustrated 'cause we don't have the solution available right damn now, but we wanted to get this out there and we will do what is equitable and right."

[WakeUpTime]

It's interesting how quickly a legal investigation has begun - not by Philips recall product users - but by Philips stock holders:

NEW YORK, NY / ACCESSWIRE / June 17, 2021 Bronstein, Gewirtz & Grossman, LLC is investigating potential claims on behalf of purchasers of Koninklijke Philips ("Philips" or "the Company") (NYSE: PHG).  The investigation concerns whether Philips and certain of its officers and/or directors have violated federal securities laws.

On June 14, 2021, Philips issued a voluntary recall of some of its sleep and respiratory care devices due to health concerns. The product recall applies to Philip’s Bi-Level Positive Airway Pressure (Bi-Level PAP) and Continuous Positive Airway Pressure (CPAP) devices as well as its mechanical ventilators, due to the sound reduction foam used in these devices. Philips said that the foam can degenerate and release dangerous elements that if inhaled can cause inflammation, irritation, headaches or even cancer. Following this news, Philips stock dropped 3.98% that same day, thereby damaging investors.

https://stockhouse.com/news/press-releas...hilips-phg
https://www.bgandg.com/phg

In the past 24 hours, Philips has issued recall notices and product warnings to a significant number of countries around the world. For most countries, a unique country-local Philips hotline number has been setup.

WebMD Announcement: https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210615...nes-recall

[Crimson Nape]

Since this is just one division of Philips, I can see them declaring bankruptcy of that division and walking away from the whole mess.   I'm sure their mega-buck lawyers and actuarial accountants are already exploring this possibility.  My thoughts are based on the planned cost of the repair/replacement, as well as, the cost of pending litigation that you know is coming.   This can easily be in the billions of dollars.  You routinely see ads on TV for monetary awards against products that are only suspected of causing harm.  Philips has admitted that it can cause harm. . . Talking about shooting yourself in the foot.