[News] RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS

[WakeUpTime]

"Corporations squash the end user, and you're left holding an empty bag

while they run all the way the bank with your money.

In April, Philips announced that it was "getting ahead of it" and "getting in front of it", when talking about its coming recall of defective systems made 2009-2021.  Users, the media and the industry may have read that expression as Philips' desire to be a quality company and help patient end-users.

Now I understand this to mean something very different altogether.  Those expressions were targeted at the financial investment industry, not the user community.  Philips was protecting its long-term stock value by announcing that it was "taking action early", when in effect, it had waited till the last possible moment that it could still safely (legally) design and implement the Philips' version of the recall.

Had country health and safety agencies initiated the process first, it would have forced Philips to accept conditions based on the best interests of defective device owning end-users.  This could be compared to a criminal on trial whose defense attorney recommends a plea bargain just prior to the judge making a decision for many years to come.  

Philips' announcement of the recall puts Philips completely in the driver's seat.  Philips was able to design its own "fix" process.  Health and consumer protection agencies are completely satisfied since Philips has stated that they will replace the foam in defective devices.  Meanwhile, Philips might take two years to replace the foam in all defective devices, while many users continue to inhale cancer-causing foam particles - contrary to Philips' demand that they immediately purchase another new replacement PAP system, protecting Philips from further liability in future years.  Many more years, world wide, are financially penalized by having to re-purchase a PAP system that is not defective.

It's extremely well played by Philips, a process well designed by Philips' legal department to protect Philips financial long-term state.  Had Philips not acted when they did, Philips might have endured significantly more costs and liabilities that might eat into the profits from other very profitable divisions in the corporation.

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Philips' generated $25 Billion in sales in 2020.

Philips has estimated it's cost to the recall at $600 Million.

Philips is indicating that its total cost of the defective

product recall will be just 2.4% of one year's sales.



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[btreger]

I have a question for qwerty42 / Post 661

When I read this post I felt that it was written but someone who really knew their stuff, not just making assumptions. 

So my question is wheater you tried to use any coating or sealant on the fiber before removal? Something that was already proven safe, would not break down and would hold the foam from degrading.

[racprops]

Sadly I am caught between the devil and the deep blue sea.

I need an ASV machine, and so far ONLY Phillips and ResMed make them.

Both companies are NOT user-friendly: Both companies are pushing for no repairs, ResMed is trying to limit their sales to only ONE owner with no resales, and have a program to currently say at 20K your machine is worn out, and needs to be replaced. I think it could become something that shuts off the machine and makes you replace it is not far off.

The costs of repairing both company's systems are kind of high...There are almost no small parts available only the mainboard and fan and some seals, price can and most likely will go higher, and Phillips has a cut-off date and at that point will not even sell any major parts, my 950 was cut off last year, no mainboards or fans.

It is an ugly situation in every way.

Rich

PS my best idea is to own both companies' ASV machines.

[btreger]

I was going through several different websites when I came to this. It is not specific to the recall but details the bigger picture of how and why we joined this forum;

This is from the ASAA

Sleep disorders, including sleep apnea, have become a significant health issue in the United States. It is estimated that 22 million Americans suffer from sleep apnea, with 80 percent of the cases of moderate and severe obstructive sleep apnea undiagnosed. OSA, which represents the great preponderance of the cases, when left untreated can lead to high blood pressure, chronic heart failure, atrial fibrillation, stroke, and other cardiovascular problems; it is associated with type 2 diabetes and depression; and is a factor in many traffic accidents and accidents with heavy machinery, owing to the persistent drowsiness suffered by many OSA patients before the disease is recognized and treated. Few outside the sleep medicine community, however, are aware that too little good sleep appears to be as much a factor in obesity as too much food and too little exercise.

Just something I think we all need to remember.

[sleeprn]

I contacted my Senator's office. I received a reply today signed by the Senator telling me he had made an inquiry to Philips and would share their response. Perhaps if a few more senators did that it would draw more attention? This is unacceptable and unforgiveable what Philips has done, and they need to be held accountable on many levels.

[WakeUpTime]

I contacted my Senator's office. 

You're that one in 100,000 people who still believes individuals can make a difference.  Great happenings always began from those few leaders in the community that wished to improve the well being of all others.  You've just motivated me to help in the process.  Maybe there are a few others too.  All we're asking for is a more timely and appropriate response to a defective medically-necessary device.

[btreger]

You're that one in 100,000 people who still believes individuals can make a difference.  Great happenings always began from those few leaders in the community that wished to improve the well being of all others.  You've just motivated me to help in the process.  Maybe there are a few others too.  All we're asking for is a more timely and appropriate response to a defective medically-necessary device.

I think your cause and believes are righteous and are sincere. But I think there is a big barrier in front of you that most politicians will let affect them, and that is the FDA, and what they have gone on the record with:

FDA Actions
The FDA is working with Philips Respironics to evaluate the issue, the scope of the recall, and the most appropriate mitigation strategies, including corrective actions by the company.
The FDA is analyzing medical device reports (MDRs) related to the affected devices over the period of 2009-2021 for reports that could be related to this issue.
The FDA does not have evidence at this time that any other CPAP machines, BiPAP machines, or ventilators, from Philips or other manufacturers, are affected.
The FDA will continue to monitor supply and demand to assess the availability of the affected devices and any potential shortages.
The FDA will continue to share updates with the public as we learn more.

[cathyf]

As for the grumbling about being the ignored little people-- that VA release included

VA has distributed approximately 300,000 of these [recalled] devices to Veterans for home use. An additional 2,000 devices are used within VA in hospital or clinic settings.

It's those 2,000 devices that have made the VA very very P*ssed. Many big hospital systems are huge customers, and they are very big and very ugly and can squash Philips like a bug.

Interestingly, the RT at my little DME tells me that she hates Respironics and only dispenses their machines when the doctor insists. The specific reason is that "Respironics doesn't listen." That's the kind of thing that kills your business.

[bollar]

I understand ResMed is sold out nearly everywhere...

For what it's worth, I was able to get a refurbished Airsense 10 Autoset from Supplier 10. The CPAP has about 200 hours on it and all the accessories were new. I think refurb / used machines are going to be the way to go. My (nationwide, insurance mandated) DME was / is completely useless and they don't know when they'll ever have an Airsense 10 or 11 in stock.

[hegel]

I don't see how what the FDA is doing is so horrible.

And to play devil's advocate: I don't see how Phillips can just magic up 100,000 new machines that don't have the foam in order to distribute them to everyone...yesterday, as people seem to expect.

It may be the "fix" will be to replace the foam inserts in existing machines. maybe Phillips can train DMEs to do this. Or maybe people will have to mail them in (!!!??!~!). It's a mess.

Maybe Phillips will ahve to reimburse people the cost of their new, non Philips machine. Poetic justice.

We don't actually live in a fantasy world where our every wish can be ordered and received by next day delivery.