[News] RECALL THREAD-- IMPORTANT PHILIPS DREAMSTATION & SYSTEM ONE USERS

[BobbieM]

Oh no I am saying that at all. What I am saying is that we should approach the issue with an open mind. Just as not everyone is a liar, not every one speaks the truth. Some PR people lie. Some don't. Some garages cheat. Some don't. 

We are human and moral hazard is something we all face. Temptations are real. Some yield to it. Some don't. 

Whether standards are followed in the vast majority of cases is not the point. The issue is whether Philips is the exception. 

A reasonable argument that a research company  is telling the truth would be, for example, that they have a track record of honesty. A bad argument would be that surely no research company worth its name would be dishonest. 

Let's see how Philips explain themselves in the coming class action suit.

[WakeUpTime]

Regarding lab testing, as someone once said, "Trust But Verify".  Not putting unshakable absolute trust in one particular incomplete sponsored lab testing facility does not of course imply that ALL laboratory testing is faulty.  To state that some are indeed suggesting that is a tactic used to solidify trust in any and all types of testing, which has created significant consumer health issues over the years for devices that were able to to rely on limited and short-term testing results.  All one has to do is look through the large database of class action lawsuits and product recalls to discover how faulty defective products were able to be initially successfully sold for significant periods of time as a result of passing initial sponsored private laboratory studies.

In the news:

Replacement Machine Raises New Concern After Philips' CPAP Recall - NBC NEWS BOSTON
https://www.nbcboston.com/multimedia/rep...l/2585897/

(As previously noted in this thread, news outlets are now beginning to publish the FDA's investigation into Philips' updated silicone foam.)

Pay out of pocket or risk death — CPAP users left in costly bind after millions are recalled - ABC NEWS TAMPA
https://www.abcactionnews.com/money/cons...e-recalled

(Some recent DreamStation 1 private purchasers are reaching out to demand financial reimbursement from Philips.)

Local family blames mother's death on faulty respiratory device - NEWS 6 CORPUS CHRISTI
https://www.kristv.com/news/local-news/l...ory-device
CPAP machine mother used recalled

(Philips' faulty ventilators won't be shown to cause extreme illnesses for most Recalled device owners in the short-term.  However, the negative health impact associated with the breakdown of Philips' defective carcinogenic foam on those with additional underlying illnesses may just be enough to significantly decrease the lifespan of those individuals.  It's unlikely that those individuals will ever be involved in product testing.)


Interestingly, this Recall thread is now the 4th most viewed thread in ApneaBoard's history.  Not surprisingly, the 3rd most viewed thread is All you wanted to know about the ResMed Airsense 10.

[Millstone50]

Sorry if this is slightly off topic, but a Reddit user dug into their machine to find this:
https://imgur.com/a/pBckANz
https://imgur.com/a/1x0qaH6

[NotADr]

Sorry if this is slightly off topic, but a Reddit user dug into their machine to find this:
https://imgur.com/a/pBckANz
https://imgur.com/a/1x0qaH6

I'm not surprised.  My Philips DS Go travel case has a light-colored lining, and there are a large number of similar-looking particles sitting on that lining. Obviously the machine has never been operated while inside the case so those particles must have fallen out of the machine's opening while sitting inside.

[LindanHotAir]

What was the history of the machine in the photos? High temperature and humidity, ozone cleaner, age?

[Fletch]

I have not been on this site in a long time until searching for help on the recall.




Are they really going to recall this or will will have to wait for this go to the lawyers to settle?

For me this issue started with a text from the supplier of the unit. It said there was a recall and they would handle the replacements. 

Then months later got another one from them basically saying "sorry it's taking so long, we have not forgotten about you.

Then before Christmas, I get a letter from Philipps saying they have forgotten about me and want me to register if I want it fixed.

Called them but of course they are closed so tried web site next.

First thing I noticed that their web site was infected with java script. I had to use chrome incognito to register as my ad blocker  did not like their site. I have to wonder if this is intentional to stop as many people as they can from registering as it sure looks like it.

Does anyone have any new information?

Thank you.

[Moriarty]

Does anyone have any new information?

Some folk here have received their replacement machines.

You do need to register though.

[WakeUpTime]

Are they really going to recall this or will will have to wait for this go to the lawyers to settle?
First thing I noticed that their web site was infected with java script. I had to use chrome incognito to register as my ad blocker did not like their site. I have to wonder if this is intentional to stop as many people as they can from registering as it sure looks like it.

As I understand it, the class action lawsuits (now consolidated into one in the U.S.) are focused on issues related to the Recall, but not the actual fix/replacement program conducted by Philips (and Philips contracted companies).  Philips states that they began the fix/replacement program on September 1, 2021, beginning with the DreamStation CPAP and APAP devices.  They then moved on to, and are working on, other DreamStation 1 models.  Although there are reports of DreamStation 2 models being received, Philips is not providing updates on the actual number of replacement devices or the percentage of recalled device registrations that have received a fix/replacement.

Regarding issues related to the Recall website, I don't remember hearing of issues related to java script or ad blockers; though that doesn't mean of course that none exist.  This may sound like a crazy comment but I hope you're 100% sure it was the actual Philips Recall site that you were on.  You can verify that you've registered either online or through the Philips contracted call center.  Please note that it's been continually reported that the contracted call center has historically provided answers directly related to the registration process, and one's registration data, and not much else.

It's a false belief that being told by Philips that a device (by serial number) is deemed faulty and subject to the Recall, and receiving a registration confirmation, is a GUARANTEE that Philips will provide a fix/replacement for that specific device.  Philips is only providing one of three answers at this time: (1) The device isn't subject to the recall, (2) the device serial number is subject to the recall and (3) the device has already been registered.

Philips has developed, and continues to develop, algorithms to determine who actually should receive a replacement and what the order of replacements will be.  From the Philips CEO's comments from a Financial Times interview, the CEO stated that Philips won't be fixing/replacing recalled systems seen by Philips as "shelved" (not currently active).  It's uncertain at this time how Philips will determine that a Recalled device is not 'active'.  

Those who already have, or will have, fixes/replacements are also concerned following the FDA's recent report on Philips new replacement (silicone) foam.  See http://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Thread-...ive-in-DS2 for more details.

"The FDA obtained additional information, not previously available to the agency, regarding the silicone-based foam used in a singular, similar device marketed outside the United States, that failed one safety test for the release of volatile organic compounds (VOCs)."
https://sleepreviewmag.com/sleep-treatme...d-devices/

[ST Dog]

Regarding lab testing, as someone once said, "Trust But Verify".  Not putting unshakable absolute trust in one particular incomplete sponsored lab testing facility does not of course imply that ALL laboratory testing is faulty.  

I'm all for the verify part, but that's not what I'm seeing.

Just as not every lab or test report is valid (though the vast majority are), not everything Phillips says or does is a lie or manipulation. Yet that's how, many are coming across, here and other places.

At this point we have a interim update from Philips saying the recent testing of the recalled foam is not producing concerning levels. Nothing conclusive yet, just promising results. Yes trying to calm fears. 

But they really can't afford to make such a statement w/o a really strong belief that it's accurate. If it was found to be a lie/rigged result it would be far worse than just not saying anything.

As for verifying, I'd love for Philips to publish the reports and labs. But that's not how the system has historically worked. The FDA is the arbiter in the USA, as designated by our elected representatives.

They get the data and their own experts review it and determine the validity. But that leads to another hole with all the mistrust of the FDA and government.

FWIW, I do something similar, but in another field. I review test plans and reports, even witness testing, done by both the OEM and 3rd party labs. Lots of development documentation too. All to try and insure a product does what it's supposed to and does it safely.

[OpalRose]

I received this email from Phillips today:

Updates and Registration information:

"If you haven't yet registered your device"
Learn more about the recall
Begin registration process
877-907-7508

December 23, 2021 - On June 14, 2021, Philips initiated a voluntary recall notification* for certain sleep and respiratory care products to address potential health risks related to the polyester-based polyurethane (PE-PUR) sound abatement foam in these devices.

https://a44529.actonservice.com/acton/ct...ADL3Qlpwmq