SoClean & other CPAP cleaning machines

[JimInPT]

I doubt you will find any fans of the So Clean device on this forum. I think the consensus is that ozone will damage plastic parts and isn't as effective as simply washing devices in soapy water.

Bill

Well, PoolQ seems to be a fan, and I'm another.  I've only been on CPAP about six weeks but have been using SoClean since the second night and have never washed the tube, gel-pillow mask, water reservoir or anything else in that time.  Since I don't use a full-face I'm not coughing back into the mask/tubing and I like the fact I'm not leaving water or soap residue in the system.

Ozone kills organisms.  It doesn't clean surfaces and doesn't penetrate buildups, but the goal is to prevent colonies from forming and buildups occurring.  When the 2-hour cycle is complete, there's a slight ozone smell in the mask, but it's gone in a few minutes, I don't mind the smell of ozone and 13 hours later when I next sleep it's not an issue.  And the entire system stays dry other than the slight amount of water vapor from the humidifier. (When I wake up and stop the CPAP cycle, the machine gently blows air through the hose/mask for some period of time, unless I turn it off, which also helps dry the tube/mask before the SoClean cycle starts.)

I wipe the gel pillows when necessary (just once, to date) and have detected ZERO residue, discoloration or buildup of any kind in my CPAP system.  Nor have any parts shown the slightest sign of deterioration from ozone - the SoClean company says current designs aren't degraded by ozone.

And for those who say simply washing the mask, tube and water reservoir are all you need to do, I have a question: how does that clean or disinfect the inside of your CPAP machine itself?  Circulating ozone through everything, including the machine, seems like a better idea than doing nothing to clean the insides.

The replacement cycle of the SoClean activated-carbon filter (used to filter the ozone gas before it enters the room) is a ripoff at 6 months (but a good revenue stream for the company, I suspect), so I took the advice of an Amazon reviewer - I bought one single spare filter cartridge and a sheet of activated-carbon for a few dollars and now I have enough to crack open the filter cartridge to replace the carbon media myself for years instead of paying $30 every six months for a dollar's worth of materials.  Same for their one-way valve (which is included with the carbon filter) - it's a one-dollar fish-tank valve that should last a very long time before needing replacement.

If anybody reading this has actually used a SoClean machine in the same manner I do, and has detected bacteria/mold growth or problems over a longer period of time than my experience, I'd love to hear from you here.

[SarcasticDave94]

FWIW:
So Clean title on link by stom:

SoClean Sanitizes CPAP Masks and Equipment, Killing 99.9% of CPAP Germs

According to Webster's Definition of sanitize
sanitized; sanitizing
transitive verb
1 : to make sanitary (as by cleaning or sterilizing)

I don't think So Clean can meet the criteria of sterilization, especially when it claims to sanitize/sterilize the water in the humidifier. Quote on their site: "The activated oxygen passes through and sanitizes the reservoir and the water within it;".

At the least, their description is misleading, as I view it.

[JimInPT]

I don't think So Clean can meet the criteria of sterilization, especially when it claims to sanitize/sterilize the water in the humidifier. Quote on their site: "The activated oxygen passes through and sanitizes the reservoir and the water within it;".

I don't have the background to state whether aerating the water with ozone will sanitize it, but it certainly wouldn't encourage bacteria growth, so why not introduce the ozone into the CPAP system at that point?  Makes sense to me.

[Stom]

FWIW:
I don't think So Clean can meet the criteria of sterilization, especially when it claims to sanitize/sterilize the water in the humidifier. Quote on their site: "The activated oxygen passes through and sanitizes the reservoir and the water within it;".

At the least, their description is misleading, as I view it.

That bit seems suspect, at least in the case of the AirSense 10. The A10 humidifier chamber is not designed to aerate the water in the chamber. Air doesn't pass "through" the water in the humidifier. It passes **over** it. Some other humidifiers may work differently.

[Walla Walla]

You can do a search on this site for SoClean and you'll get lot's of input from there. Some of them are at the bottom of this page. The one thing I do know is some, I repeat some people do get skin irritations from the ozone that SoClean uses. Just something to think about FWIW.

[Stom]

You can do a search on this site for SoClean and you'll get lot's of input from there. Some of them are at the bottom of this page. The one thing I do know is some, I repeat some people do get skin irritations from the ozone that SoClean uses. Just something to think about FWIW.

Which is ironic since SoClean brags:

"The sanitizing process is completely natural – no water or harsh chemicals needed!"

Uhm, no, the process is completely artificial and uses an artificially created toxic chemical. The **toxicity** is why it works as a sanitizer.

I do think there can be advantages to Ozone disinfection in certain circumstances as it doesn't leave lingering toxic chemicals behind when, for instance, it is used to disinfect water. But I also think SoClean makes some questionable claims in its marketing.

I don't know if the people in the threads are really getting skin irritation from ozone itself, from byproducts of materials damaged by ozone, or something else.

[PoolQ]

"SoClean sells with scare tactics. It uses heavy marketing to get people to buy it." I agree and said so in my post
"It even claims to prevent sinus infections " this does not need a link, it is true in at least one situation, IF bacteria is present on the inside surface then you could speculate that if the CPAP was turned on as is, that bacteria could cause a sinus infection. They are simply claiming that soclean "could" prevent that by killing that bacteria. It can do that. it does not say "always" "from then on" or any other claim

SoClean also tries to rebrand toxic ozone gas we yes indeed this is not good for you, even though you can still buy ozone generators for your house and car. THe SoClean company seems to already know this and the machine has an activated charcoal exhaust filter in the chamber. So ozone is converted back into O2 before it exits the system. So while the SoClean does indeed generate Ozone, that Ozone does not escape the system. The mask does however smell of Ozone right after using the SoClean, I have no idea if the concentration is harmful or not. Based on the amount of time the product has been on the market and the other products on the market that intentionally release Ozone into the air, I would not worry about it. Even my well known brand of HEPA air filter "machine" uses ions to clean the air and neutralizes the ions before the air exits the machine. BTY you make O2 with ionization.


Personal opinion is an interesting concept. You can claim that in your opinion a product is not useful. However claiming actual specific claiming that a product does not do what a company claims, or causes harm, is a different story. If you can go into court and be adjudicated an expert in that field, then your opinion is valid. If not and you are just saying what you have read on a chat site and by doing so are harming a person or company, well then this is a problem. We have no idea what research they have or have not done or what claims a lawyer has "okayed" them to claim.


I don't care what the company claims or has proof, I will leave that to others to take them to court if they want. However form an educational website to be supporting unsubstantiated posts that defame a company or product could be problematic. Cease and desist orders are pretty easy to get.

[foss]

Back in the days when I was an industrial hygienist, I had to consider the concentration of ozone in the work place atmosphere from time to time. Very small amounts of ozone are irritating and harmful for normal working folks. Those that may have any kind of compromise to their respiratory system would be much more sensitive. Individuals with something like COPD or asthma would be well advised to avoid any chance of ozone exposure.

BTW, that "clean" smell when you start using your cpap after using the SoClean machine is probably residual ozone.

Just my 2 cents....

[JimInPT]

I don't care what the company claims or has proof, I will leave that to others to take them to court if they want.

FYI to add just a bit of info to that, here's their website link to a lab report documenting testing done, from April of this year. Commercial Link Removed. Instead do a search for: Efficacy Report Summarization for SoClean 2 on their website.

I think the test essentially says the machine generates ozone and that yes, ozone kills organisms.  But we knew that already.  It seems like a valid test setup, with lab cultures in various places on an actual Dreamstation mask setup.  I'll leave it to our forum bacteriologists to evaluate the report's credibility.

Just doing my part to close up that ol' debbil Ozone Hole.

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[Stom]

"SoClean sells with scare tactics. It uses heavy marketing to get people to buy it." I agree and said so in my post
"It even claims to prevent sinus infections " this does not need a link, it is true in at least one situation, IF bacteria is present on the inside surface then you could speculate that if the CPAP was turned on as is, that bacteria could cause a sinus infection. They are simply claiming that soclean "could" prevent that by killing that bacteria. It can do that. it does not say "always" "from then on" or any other claim

I'd say SoClean is making a claim of fact, trying to represent that sinus infections from CPAPs are a common and ongoing danger unless you buy and use their product. They do not say it is speculation. The problem is that their speculation is contradicted by at least one scientific study:

Conclusions:

Having a positive culture in the CPAP reservoir does not seem to lead to an increased symptomatology of CRS: although the reservoirs often become colonized, there seems to be no clinical impact.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3716664/

Data trumps speculation. IMO SoClean should not claim or imply that it prevents sinus infections without at least a peer-reviewed study to confirm that claim.

I don't care what the company claims or has proof

I think that kind of ends the discussion. If we can't agree to discuss it based on facts and objective evidence there isn't much point in having a conversation.

I don't care what the company claims or has proof, I will leave that to others to take them to court if they want. However form an educational website to be supporting unsubstantiated posts that defame a company or product could be problematic. Cease and desist orders are pretty easy to get.

They kind of aren't. The right to free speech is explicitly guaranteed by the constitution, so any government orders abridging free speech, such as orders to remove speech from publication, are subject to a very high bar. And it takes more than a mere disagreement of opinion to make that bar.