Can someone explain how EPR reduces flow limitation?

[SeePak]

Szabo, i want to add to your comment about the lungs not being fully emptied.

I would like to know if you, and others, agree with the following...

For air to get to the bottom of the lungs where the alveoli are, breathing needs to be slow, light and deep.

[G. Szabo]

I would like to know if you, and others, agree with the following...

For air to get to the bottom of the lungs where the alveoli are, breathing needs to be slow, light and deep.

It sounds reasonable. Yoga has been promoting similar techniques for centuries. Nevertheless, my opinion does not count when it comes to medical practice. We should look into the practice of operating professional respirators in hospitals. 
By the way, each of these respirators utilizes more than 3 EPRs.

[SeePak]

Szabo, yes and i believe it is scientific, not just reasonable, but here's why i ask and what i want to point out.....

Almost all of us have breathing problems depending on what science you read.

Thats why we have sleep apnea in the first place!

Would you also agree that CPAP may be the gold standard, however it treats the symptoms, not the cause?
It does not fix our breathing or our airway properties.

You can see it in the charts.
Sometimes you see fast/shallow frequent breaths,   that would preclude air even reaching the bottom of lungs, as it would mostly be changing only in the upper airways.

so my point here is we MUST get our breathing corrected, with breathing exercises,  at the same time we use CPAP!

Oh, and btw, yoga was meant for breathing to be slow, light and deep.

The deep part was mis-interpreted thru the years, to mean large fast breaths, which is exactly opposite, and because of this mis-information, people are re-enforcing bad breathing habits!

[Sleeprider]

CPAP and most spontaneous bilevel PAP are useful to stent upper airway tissue and mitigate the symptoms of flow limitation, hypopnea and obstructive apnea. These are not respiratory assist devices (RAD) that are capable of altering the rate or volume of spontaneous respiration. A person with pulmonary impairments that prevent normal tidal volume or respiratory rate that affects their overall health, should be prescribed an appropriate RAD or ventilator for their condition. Even with bilevel therapy, it is very difficult to influence minute volume or pulmonary function. A diagnosis of obstructive sleep apnea does not mean a person has a breathing problem or pulmonary issue beyond the obstruction of the upper airway. You will see members post charts here that vary considerably in tidal volume, respiratory rate, I:E ratio and other metrics, and positive air pressure can help to remove the obstructive component that affects those metrics. Beyond that, we need a few more tools.

People with or without OSA rarely fill the alvoli in the lungs to dull capacity and expire that entire volume in any breath. This describes a forced expiratory volume or forced vital capaciy test in a pulmonary function test. If we routinely did that we would pass out. Good pulmonary health is important to all of us, but it's not the target of CPAP or spontaneous bilevel, which are mainly used to normalize the relaxed sleep respiration of a sleeping individual with obstructive airway disorders, not pulmonary or neurological disorders.

[SeePak]

Sleeprider.

Depending on how a 'breathing problem' is defined would determine if not all people that have OSA have a breathing problem.

Anatomical, physiological and psychological all play a part for sure.

Sorry, did not really want to get into a pissing contest here, i probably provoked it, my mistake.

What i find interesting but also frustrating is how the industry experts can disagree between themselves.

I'm just wading thru all the science to help find how i can have a life without CPAP.

And breathing appears to be a way out, as claimed by others who have done it.

Back to the thread subject, EPR and flow limitation, i have had a history of CA events and obstructive when EPR is used.

Looking at my Oscar overview and drilling down i find that when EPR was used AND the pressure drops below 6 cm or so, i get obstructive events.
That lead me to make sure that when i used EPR i made sure i stayed above that level, and it definitely made a difference. ( i got that from this site in Wiki !)
However, CA events became a problem leading to much time in apnea, which must have lead to bad sleep !?
And so far, CA events are still an issue even without EPR!

If i was sleeping OK during the night and not the day, i would never have made it to this website nor would i be probing in detail thru all the Oscar data.

In retrospect, i'm glad i did, cause i am learning so much from this site!

Thank you all.

[Sleeprider]

Just to clarify, I don't consider any disagreement to be a "pissing contest". If the point of the forum was to establish one point of view, it would not be a discussion. An idea that is disputed can make all participants involved or observing think about what is being proposed and end up with a better understanding. FWIW, it would be a better world if we could treat all forms of dispute similarly with an open mind.

[SeePak]

Sleeprider, thanx for that.

I get worried i am being argumentative sometimes.

Feel better now, thanx !

So the other thought that i wanted to respond to was breathing slow, light and deep ( from diaphragm) would be excessive and cause us to pass out.

I dont understand that statement, am i paraphrasing you correctly?

[Sleeprider]

Not really. I was describing a forced full inspiration or exhale. I think we are all better off breathing in a normal comfortable manner. Once you fall asleep the subconscious takes over anyway. This is especially important for ASV which targets the previous 90 seconds of breath rate and volume and can be really messed up by “thinking “ about your breathing.

[SeePak]

sleeprider, yes i agree, overbreathing, hyper ventilation is a problem.

Definitely want LSD, light, slow and deep ( diaphragmatic) breathing

[G. Szabo]

Here you can find some added info:

https://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Thread...-decreased