Help Finding A Machine, No Insurance

[SJGino]

Hello,

I'm new to this Forum and Actually new to using a Machine. I just had a sleep study test done about 2 month ago, but recently got denied a machine because insurance doesn't cover it. Just a quick history, feel alseep at the well after sleeping 10 hours and crashed. Hospital suggest i do a sleep test because it sounded like i have seep apnea and it doesn't help i'm 450 lbs. long story short, i have bad sleep apnea during the test i had maxed out at 25 i believe and my prescription says i need an auto bipap.

So my question here is after doing some research i have come to like the RESPIRONICS DREAMSTATION BIPAP AUTO WITH HEATED HUMIDIFIER and i was wondering where do i post to get info on this machine and where the best deal was and how to go about getting it set up? Any information can help as i am new to everything about this.

Thank you in advance

[DeepBreathing]

G'day SJGino, welcome to Apnea Board.

I've moved this thread to the main forum where it will get greater exposure.

The Dreamstation is a fairly new machine and Respironics is one of the top two manufacturers of CPAP machines, so at face value that's a good choice. Because the Dreamstation is new on the market, you may be able to get a deep discount on the recently superseded System 1 series. I'll let one of the Respironics experts advise as to the exact model - I never was able to understand Respironics' naming convention.

There is a list of suppliers which you can access at the top of this page. We don't endorse any particular supplier, but those on the list have a good reputation. By shopping around you should be able to get a reasonable package. Supplier #2 is known for lower prices on "gently used" and "open box" specials.

Remember that in addition to the machine you also need a mask, hose, filters etc. The mask is the hardest part - getting a mask which fits well and doesn't leak is often a case of trial and error. A good place to start is the ResMed P10 nasal pillows, which has two soft prongs which just seal against the outer edge of your nostrils. A lot of people swear by the P10 - personally I can't stand it! My favourite is the F&P full face Simplus, which is also very popular. Because of the difficulty in getting a comfortable well fitting mask, ensure that your supplier has some sort of trial / replacement deal.

To set the machine up, you can get hold of the clinical manual here: http://www.apneaboard.com/adjust-cpap-pr...tup-manual Follow the instructions carefully to make sure you get the right one. You could also post your prescription details here and one of the Respironics experts can walk you through the process.

I also strongly suggest you get hold of the #Sleepyhead software, which will allow you to monitor and fine tune your therapy.

Hope this helps - happy to answer any more questions you might have.

[Sleeprider]

SJ, even though your insurance denied coverage, you should enure you have copies of your sleep study and the prescription. the Dreamstation BiPAP Auto (DX700T11) is an excellent bilevel machine and is therapeutically identical to the Philips Respironics 60 Series BiPAP Auto (DS760P), which may be much less expensive as it was discontinued a few months ago.

I have one of those as a backup. I'm curious why you have sett led on that particular machine, rather than an auto CPAP. Sounds like you've really done your homework, and you know the bilevel will be more expensive. I can help you find inexpensive channels to buy through, but would like to hear your reasons for selecting this machine, and whether you would consider a used machine, or the older model PRS1 60 series.

[robysue]

SJGino,

Once you have a copy of your prescription, you can and should consider buying your machine on-line.

As a PR BiPAP Auto user, I can tell you that the differences between the newest PR DreamStation BiPAP Auto and the slightly older, but now discontinued PR System One Series 60 BiPAP Auto are minimal. You might very well find a PR System One Series 60 BiPAP for less money than the DreamStation. For example, Supplier #1 has the System One Series 60 BiPAP Auto listed for $970 (including the heated hose version of the humidifier). The DreamStation BiPAP Auto plus heated hose humidifier lists for $1870. Several other of the vendors on the Supplier list would probably still have the System One Series 60 machines in stock for significantly less money than a DreamStation.

You might want to consider Supplier #2 on the Supplier list. They sell gently used and refurbished machines as well as some open-box new machines. You do need to pay attention to the exact model number you want to get from them. Many of the PR BiPAPs in their inventory are the older Legacy and M-series machines, which in my opinion are too outdated. (You can't easily get any efficacy data off of them and they are not compatible with the SleepyHead software that many of us use.) However Vendor #2 does have PR System One BiPAP Pro and Autos for sale. They have System One Series 50 BiPAP Autos listed for $690 with a humidifier and the Series 60 BiPAP Auto about $750 (with a heated hose compatible humidfier). The Series 50 machines are almost the same as the Series 60, but do not come with a heated hose option.

[SJGino]

First off thank you to everyone here so far, Can't believe the quick, friendly and very informative replies. I guess i came to the right place.

Well i actually used this machine for my sleep study a month or so ago. It was really quiet and during the study it seem really easy to use compared to the one my dad used. Also since the dr said that i maxed out during my test on air pressure, she suggested an auto bipap because she said that once i use the machine and go through therapy for awhile i may be able to go to a lower pressure eventually but that i will need a machine for the long time so after doing some researched it just seemed like it would be better to get something that will have many features kind of like an all in one machine. Actually i really dont know much other then that, but i am open to suggestions and recommendations. Just want to get the right machine.

Also read some reviews and people seem to be very please with it for the length that i will be needing it for. The sleep lab where i took the test actually fitted me for mask and gave me 4 masks that worked with me during my test. 2 full face mask and 2 hybrid nose/mouth mask as well as extra tubing.

My sleep lab actually said once i buy the machine because i was denied for my insurance they well set up my bipap machine for free. All i need to do is buy one. But i definitely will use the sleepyhead program as i want to make sure i can the rest i need. It sucks falling asleep every where.

edit:Also, whats the benefits of a humidifier, a heated humidifier, or even a heated tub? Thank you again for every ones help.

[robysue]

Well i actually used this machine for my sleep study a month or so ago. It was really quiet and during the study it seem really easy to use compared to the one my dad used.

The DreamStation is a bit quieter than the PR System One Series 60 and Series 50 machines. And it doesn't have the annoying beep that the Series 50 has. (The Series 60's beep can be turned totally off.)

What machine did (does) your dad use? If it was a machine from 10 years ago, then yeah, they're a whole lot quieter now.

Also since the dr said that i maxed out during my test on air pressure, she suggested an auto bipap because she said that once i use the machine and go through therapy for awhile i may be able to go to a lower pressure eventually but that i will need a machine for the long time so after doing some researched it just seemed like it would be better to get something that will have many features kind of like an all in one machine.

The PR DreamStation BiPAP Auto, the PR System One Series 60 BiPAP Auto, and the PR System One Series 50 BiPAP Auto all allow the max IPAP to be set as high as 25cm. (A regular CPAP/APAP only goes up to 20cm.)

The LCD data on the DreamStation is a bit better and it is compatible with whatever the PR website is, whereas the System Ones won't automatically talk to the website. However, you get more data out of all three machines if you use SleepyHead to read the data written directly to the SD card. The data that is gathered by all three machines is exactly the same.

All three machines have the same Bi-Flex system (if you want it) for an additional bit of exhalation relief. On all three machines, you can turn Bi-Flex off if you don't like it. All three machines have a ramp feature if you want to use it. Only the DreamStation has the SmartRamp mode. In SmartRamp mode, the machine waits until it thinks you are asleep before starting to ramp up the pressure; in regular Ramp mode, the pressure ramps up over a fixed amount of time. SmartRamp is probably more comfortable, but many people find that they don't need the ramp feature after the first few weeks. But then if you are using really high pressures you may find a correctly set SmartRamp may make you more comfortable when you are falling asleep.

edit:Also, whats the benefits of a humidifier, a heated humidifier, or even a heated tub? Thank you again for every ones help.

Are you currently using a humidifier?

Many, but not all, people find that using a heated humidifier increases the comfort of using the machine. A lot of people have trouble with the nasal passages getting dried out while using xPAP, and the heated humidifier adds a small amount of moisture to the air being blown down your throat. I have to have the humidifier maxed out or my nose is very unhappy. My husband only needs a bit of humidity. My brother personally hates humidified air and he doesn't use a humidifier at all.

Some people also find that having a heated humidifier helps when you've got a head cold or a lot of congestion.

The biggest advantage of a heated hose (as opposed to a heated humidifier) is that a heated hose minimizes the chances of rainout. Rainout occurs with the water vapor in the hose or mask condenses. If enough water vapor condenses, you can wake up with water dripping down on your nose or face if the machine or hose is higher than your head. Or you can wake up to a gurgling sound if there's a low spot in the hose where the condensed water formed a puddle.

Actually i really dont know much other then that, but i am open to suggestions and recommendations. Just want to get the right machine.

The question here is how much money you want to spend. If you don't mind spending about $1800 or so, I'd say get the DreamStation since it's the newest machine and you've already been using it and it's got the SmartRamp and slightly better on-board data. But if money is a serious problem for you, then going with the slightly older PR System One Series 60 BiPAP can save you $800 or more without the need to seriously compromise on any of the important therapeutic features your current DreamStation has. Only you can figure out whether the SmartRamp and better on-board LCD data is worth $800 averaged out over a five to seven year period.

Also read some reviews and people seem to be very please with it for the length that i will be needing it for. The sleep lab where i took the test actually fitted me for mask and gave me 4 masks that worked with me during my test. 2 full face mask and 2 hybrid nose/mouth mask as well as extra tubing.

That's great. You'll have some masks to play with.

Does the extra tubing plug into the socket on the DreamStation or does it just have a rubber coupling without a plug?

If the tubing has a plug built in, then you've got a heated hose for your DreamStation, the heated hose won't work as a heated hose on any other xPAP. If not, it's a standard hose that will be compatible on any CPAP.

My sleep lab actually said once i buy the machine because i was denied for my insurance they well set up my bipap machine for free. All i need to do is buy one. But i definitely will use the sleepyhead program as i want to make sure i can the rest i need. It sucks falling asleep every where.

It sounds like you've got a good sleep lab.

Again: Any of the following three PR BiPAP Autos will work with SleepyHead:

The PR DreamStation BiPAP Auto is the current, up-to-date PR biPAP.

The PR System One Series 60 BiPAP Auto is one generation back and except for the SmartRamp feature and the better LCD data, it has all the same features and does everything the DreamStation does.

The PR System One Series 50 BiPAP Auto is two generations back, but it is virtually identical to the PR System One Series 60 except for a heated hose option and a min PS setting in Auto mode that is not terribly important for most people.

[Galactus]

SJGino, I know many will be annoyed at me, but I have to tell you, no matter what anyone says, if you are educated and know what you are looking at, and looking for, you will not find a better deal than on Craigs List. I was at 19 straight and got stuck with a straight CPAP. Thanks to the people on this forum I went out and bought my own unit (the one listed in my profile) it had less than 50 hours on it and it cost me less than $300. Over the years I've found many good deals on CPAP on CL ads and have bought them to sell them to many of the used suppliers, as well as to have a backup. To give you some perspective, they usually pay me roughly 50% of what they sell them for, and I usually pay roughly 50% of that. So do yourself a favor and check it out. Then come here and we'll help you set it up right. These guys on this forum saved me a ton of money and a ton of aggravation. There are so many CL people who get these machines use them a week and quit, the deals are everywhere. --- My apologies to anyone I may have offended.

[justMongo]

I have one of those as a backup. I'm curious why you have sett led on that particular machine, rather than an auto CPAP. Sounds like you've really done your homework, and you know the bilevel will be more expensive. I can help you find inexpensive channels to buy through, but would like to hear your reasons for selecting this machine, and whether you would consider a used machine, or the older model PRS1 60 series.

I think a bilevel was the OPs choice because they can go to 25 cm-water. OP stated that "he maxed out at 25."

[Sleeprider]

Going back to my original post, asking why the auto bipap was the choice, the answers are clear and well thought out. You have more choices since you have a prescription in hand. If financial cost is a primary concern, then Craigslist is great way to acquire a machine, if you have the time and know what you're looking for. The SearchTempest search engine can identify a machine by going through listings nationally, using a radar search, so it returns the closest results first. The only trick is knowing what to search for. The Dreamstation BiPAP is so new, that there will not be any used or secondary market machines. The Philips Respironics System One (PRS1) 60 Series BiPAP Auto does come up frequently, and can be obtained used for $300-$500. Just make sure you are getting the model DS760, and not something else.

For the Dreamstation, any online vendor in our supplier list can supply the machine. Robysue pointed to Supplier #1 as having both the PRS1 BiPAP auto for $970 and the Dreamstation BiPAP auto for $1870. I think that is pretty typical. Supplier #30 sells the Dreamstation for $1639 and will bill your insurance so you at least get deductibles credited if there is coverage, but a high deductible or copay.

[SJGino]

Again, thank you all for your responses and help. I'm gonna consider going with the PR series one auto bipap, and check around craigslist. The only issue is i have a credit card that i am using and no cash, so at the moment i am leaning on supplier 2 for the series one DS760, it has the option to get the humidifier as well as the heated tubing. I will probably do a last few hours of research and make my purchase today and let everyone know when i get it and how its working out.