I'd love a review of my data and/or advice, esp. re. waking up at night

[danielsomers]

I finally got somewhat used to the  CPAP after about eight months. But I'm still having trouble with waking up at night and taking it off. Either I'm half  asleep and it just comes off, or I wake up fully and can't get back to sleep with the thing on. I know during a second sleep test I did there was some tendency to wake up because of an apnea event. It doesn't look to me from the data like this is a problem now, but I wonder if there may be something subtle that I'm not catching. 

Note that my pressure setting is pretty low--starting at six and then ramping up to eight. I think they made this adjustment because I was having problems with my nose and mouth getting totally dessicated. I think during that second sleep test they did a titration and determined that at that point I needed a much higher pressure, but it seems to me like this lower pressure is working pretty well. 

One other thing. Is there a way to spot REM sleep in the graphs? My apnea is considered "mild," except that it almost all happens in REM--so I'm told that effectively it's more like "moderate." A guy on a reddit forum said that respiration rate goes up but I'm not seeing that, so either it doesn't show or I'm not getting any REM sleep. Well--or it shows but it's very subtle.

I'll attach some screenshots of the  OSCAR data, thanks in advance for any input!

p.s. Hmm. It doesn't seem to let me add a fourth screenshot, so there's one more from that night that's not included.

[danielsomers]

If I could add one more question that maybe some of you will know about. (I can no longer edit the main post.) I've been using a little cannabis (vaping) when I can't get back to sleep. I have some pretty intense stress and actually also dealing with PTSD, so just one puff, sometimes two, helps a lot. I also know it's not good for REM sleep. My hope is that because I'm vaping and it's fairly short-lived effect, and also lowish dose, it may be ok. Thoughts on that?

[danielsomers]

Giving this a bump, is anyone knowledgeable able to have a look? Thanks!

[Plmnb]

 FOLLOWING

I'm sorry I can't help you regarding your particular situation.  I am however interested in replies you might receive regarding the cannabis. I myself get up multiple times.  I also have lousy REM sleep.

I have been told I have insomnia, the kind that keeps you from STAYING asleep.  It was suggested on another board that my medications very possibly have been negatively affecting my sleep.  Especially the antidepressants.  

So Monday I went and applied and received my marijuana card.  I went to the dispensary and discussed my situation with the representative.  She recommended two products to try because the have shown efficacy in maintaining sleep.  (I purchased an invicta (?) tincture and some gummies).  She suggested I try the gummies first.

The first night I tried the gummy I had no large leaks for the first time, although I did awaken at times.  Last night, again, no large leaks!  But alas, still woke up a few times. I have been thinking the cannabis is causing me to have a more "relaxed" sleep, less movement that might have been dislodging my mask. 

I wonder how to determine from the OSCAR charts what is considered the DEEP SLEEP stage as well as the REM sleep stage?

I am very interested in anyone's take on the use of cannabis in the treatment of sleep apnea. 


I did NOT know that cannabis can affect REM sleep.  When I Googled this fact this is what I found: 



"Short-term cannabis use appears to increase the time you spend in deep sleep, the stage that helps you wake up feeling refreshed. However, THC decreases the amount of time you spend in rapid eye movement (REM) sleep, when you spend more time dreaming, processing emotions, and cementing new memories." 

[danielsomers]

Hi--interesting to hear these similarities. 

That makes sense that the cannabis would have those effects. Do you like the indica? I've found that can make things a little dark for me--but then part of the thing for me is that my stress load is really high right now, some disturbing stuff, so the indica--which is more of a "downer" than sativa or hybrid--can contribute to the negativity. I mention that because if you ever run into that, I find that a hybrid works well enough for sleep and doesn't have the downer effect. 

Yes, the cannabis/REM connection is troubling. My hope is that because I'm vaping and it's shorter lived, that there's still enough time for REM to happen. But if you find out elsewhere, could you let me know--and I'll do same. 

Antidepressants can have all sorts of unexpected effects like that. I got off those some years ago and have been awfully glad since--although I know some people do well with them.

Ok, thanks for chiming in!

[Plmnb]

Thanks for responding danielsomers!

My history with cannabis suggests I should stay away from sativa, it makes me even more anxious than I already am.  Even the dispensary advisor said I should stick with the indica because of this.  Although, I didn't think to ask about a hybrid.

The tincture, which I haven't tried yet is an RSO which is a long lasting, fast acting form of cannabis. The representative suggested I only use it when I have the day off work the next day after I use it. 

I'm not sure I am as concerned about the REM issue as the DEEP SLEEP issue.  I mean it used to concern me that I don't seem to have hardly any dreams, but should this be as concerning as the DEEP SLEEP issue?  I think for me may be the DEEP SLEEP issue.

Please keep posting you cannabis experiences, I hope to learn from them.

Have a wonderful day!

[danielsomers]

Hi again...

Sativa would not be good for sleep pretty much for anyone I think--it tends to be energizing..hence the anxiety element. I find that a hybrid is just relaxing enough that it helps me sleep but isn't dark--although I'm just realizing now that an indica might keep me asleep for longer. I find the hybrid only works really for an hour or two, but sometimes it gets me over the hump. I'm trying not to use it because of the REM thing but still am several nights a week.

"Deep sleep" is maybe in a way misleading. I think it is deep, but apparently what happens during REM, even though less "deep," is very important, I think to memory and emotional processing, and also to long-term brain health. I believe there's a connection between lack of REM and dementia. At 61 and with 15 years of antidepressants and some benzos for sleep at times--both of those may link to dementia, especially benzos--I'm trying to do what I can to make sure I get enough. 

DS

[SeePak]

my 2 cents worth about cannibis....

Smoking for 45 yrs. stopped here and there for maybe a few months, cant remember !  ( probably the weed )

I am now off for 1 month.

Thought i needed for creativity.
Nope, more creative now than ever.
Strike one.

Thought i needed for stress.
Nope, found breathing exercises, dropped my stress and anxiety, and almost no procrastination
Strike two.

Thought i needed for sleep.
Doubt it, but...
i have been using CPAP for 35+ years.
It has been hit and miss.
Forgotten what it is like to go awhile with good nights rest.
And finding much info about how cannibis can and does screw up my brain, check out Dr. Amen on the internet.
And finding out about breathing exercises from Patrick McKeown check out the net.
And all the vast amount of data here on this Apnea Board and Wiki that i can find.
Got my leak rate almost always down to almost negligible, that was a must, used to be 40 % !
Found proper mask and how to adjust etc. here on this site.
And i now know i am getting close to getting my sleep back to normal, with more NATURAL adjustments on the horizon including Cervical adjustments, check out Dr Hauser.
And positional apnea was a problem, check out the articles about neck collars.
So for me Cannibis is not needed for sleep either.
Strike 3 youre out!
I hope.....
Cause i don't care what they say about Cannibis, for me, it IS ADDICTIVE.

Hope that helps you two and others?