Discussion on alternate treatments for sleep apnea

[Breathworker]

As Dan Aykroyd used to say when he would do his Tom Snyder impersonation many years ago on Saturday Night Live, "Okay, sir, fair enough".

Knocking on an open door sure beats knocking on a closed one.

Like I said, I hardly have it all figured out. I'm using an oral appliance. Might be easier to mouth tape with CPAP than the appliance, I don't know.

Of course, next year we all might have the option of trying AD109.

[SeePak]

So here I am, wide awake, 4 am in the morning,..
Typing, cause I still have mouth tape on and can't use my voice auto texting!

A few things on my mind now, some might be for another thread, got a LOT to unpack!
Here goes....

Ate late, huge salad, tried to wait 3 hrs b4 bed,  good sleep hygiene , just made it to 3 hours

But..

I have acid reflux going on, I feel burning etc

I was having chipmunk cheeks when I awoke

I had very wet mouth lots of saliva

Finally, I noticed mouth tape slowly leaking

Also think I awoke due to dream and heavy breathing episode
Key point..I remembered my breathing exercise b4 bed and I did it and stopped heavy breathing dead in it's tracks and I quickly relaxed with regular heartbeat. Nice!

Question, theory

Can all this be connected?

Did the tape on my mouth keep gas in my system?
Did acid reflux cause heavy saliva in my mouth which caused mouth tape to weaken at corners of my mouth?
Did acid reflux cause my dream?
Did acid reflux contribute or cause chipmunk cheeks? 
I have very low CPAP pressure now 6.2cm

Why am I suddenly having dreams ( had a few lately) cause I have not had many in a long time, and now I am remembering them.
Better sleep? Finally getting to REM stage?

'Breathworker' commented about Patrick McKeown theory that lower CPAP pressure could lead to less arousals.
I read and watched the videos a week ago when they were posted.
Yesterday, coincidentally, I was looking thru my last night's almost perfect sleep results on Oscar.
I began to use the bookmark function in Oscar to mark the few episodes I had where there was a flow or pressure drop and/or spike.
What struck me was my flow would most often stay controlled even when there was a disturbance.
AND 
I am now using as low a pressure as I have in awhile, 
Made possible, in my Subjective belief , because of the hold your breath breathing exercise I have been doing PLUS taping my mouth closed!!!

Objective Data?
I can post my results at some point for all to see!

I probably have more to say but this typing, on my cell phone , no less, is getting tedious!

I want to give a huge thankyou to 'Breathworker' for his thread and info. and for hanging in there when he was being challenged for his info.
And
Big thankyou again to this community of caring humans for accepting him and providing their feedback.

AND
Really, should this thread NOT be in the main Apnea posting area?

Comments?

[SeePak]

Szabo, i would like to re-iterate a few points from the video.

Nasal breathing, yes we do that here on Apnea board, while using mouth tape.

Some of us use full face etc. without mouth tape. If we then still mouth breathe, that would setup the scenario that the video is trying to avoid, which causes all the same problems.

Also, the video and other info that Patrick McKeown is suggesting, is about HOW we breathe.
Even if we have our mouths closed AND nose breathe, we may be using TOO MUCH air volume!
This can cause snoring as he points out.
This can cause Obstructive Sleep Apnea as he points out.
Also, i have heard many stories from people on this site that suggest even with low AHI and doing all these things they still have issues and sometimes low quality sleep.
Patrick is suggesting and says he as seen this in thousands of people who get results by following some breathing exercises.
Also, he suggests mouth breathing ALL DAY is just as bad !
I agree, and have begun using chinstrap a lot during the day, at time when necessary when i find i am opening my mouth.

We need to focus on the above elements to TRULY begin to appreciate ALL that Patrick is saying.

Check our breathing BPM, check our Minute Volumes.

Please, let's continue this conversation !?

Respectfully!

[G. Szabo]

Even if we have our mouths closed AND nose breathe, we may be using TOO MUCH air volume!

This is the first time I have learned that there are cases when someone (who is not on some instrument) can inhale too much air, except hyperventilation. This is truly new! I will watch the video again and any other source you suggest. 

I would also be interested in the comments of some of our veterans on this forum.  

[SeePak]

RE: Alternative Therapy to CPAP (Nasal Breathing

"G. Szabo
You will need a sleep study to be sure. A Ring Oximeter would provide some insights, but it is not perfect. It also records the HR. My HR increases at apnea events."
_______________________<<<<_____________________

I was doing a search on the internet and I came across a reference to Patrick McKeown on the sleep apnea board! 
I clicked the link and voila, found this comment.
I don't see any further comments and I'm wondering what happened to this post?

I'm thinking the two could be linked or something that would be up to the moderators to figure out?

[mews]

Hello Breathworker;
I think you're on to something with Patrick M.'s Buteyko breathing methods.
Have you looked into U.S. doctor Dylan Petkus's work he's doing as well?
I'm just starting looking into Petkus's work.

[SeePak]

Yes Mews.

I have been doing exercises especially before bed for almost 2 weeks since I found out about this and they are wonderful all kinds of huge results already.
My nose has been less plugged which is allowed me to use lower CPAP pressure and I have at times close to no events it's working out splendidly.
And the games are in places you wouldn't expect although I know Patrick knew about it such as anxiety which is really drop for me as well as procrastination.
Check it out and you'll see how it works I noticed something within a day and I was doing a lot of the exercises but if you do the same thing I assure you you will notice the difference in your life.

[mews]

Thank you for taking time to write your encouraging post. I’m going to work on this asap. I’m ready for results that you’ve described. It’s groundbreaking, and yes, I’ve done enough research to know it’s possible.

[SeePak]

It won't take long Mews to see tangible results.
Everybody will be a bit different I'm sure I was pretty screwed up so I saw results quickly LOL

Breathing is a way of life !

Enjoy!

[Breathworker]

Hello Breathworker;
I think you're on to something with Patrick M.'s Buteyko breathing methods.
Have you looked into U.S. doctor Dylan Petkus's work he's doing as well?
I'm just starting looking into Petkus's work.

Hello, mews.

Glad you're getting into Patrick McKeown and Buteyko breathing. I've found it to be great stuff, highly beneficial, and I'm happy you and SeePak and others are benefitting from it as well.

My apologies if I have not been too active on this forum of late. Life is a bit too busy and stressful for me these days, and I still all too often don't sleep well, which can sometimes put me in a very negative place. This too shall pass. Hopefully.

So yeah I have much to work on these days in keeping my parasympathetic nervous system activated instead the inaptly named sympathetic nervous system, which is anything but. 

I'm familiar with Dylan Petkus. In looking into him I saw he was discussed on this forum a while back, long before I joined. The last post in the thread about him said something along the lines of stay far away. I don't know if that would necessarily deter me, but the bottom line for me is that I simply couldn't afford him right now. And if I had the money I would rather invest in a breathing coach and someone like Lois Laynee.